The Disturbing Floatplane Business

[Dizzy1]

Somewhat related ...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-c ... -1.2933202

Airport noise: 3 people made 66 per cent of complaints to YVR

Kinda reminds me of a handful people here

[tsayta]

Tesla is coming out with a new float plane. The Model SHH. Should help

[fall]

Not being there to see what the plane was doing, but having spent many summers at a water base with many different sizes and types of planes landing and taking off on the water, you may not realize it, but maybe the most dangerous water condition for float planes is calm winds with no waves, it requires the most precise piloting techniques.

Not talking about many sizes and types of planes taking off on the water, what water base have you spent many summers at? Not many float planes on Okanagan, and they are all roughly the same size. Could probably count them on one hand in Kelowna.
So we have you saying that calm waters require the most precise techniques and the other guy saying it is the wind amongst other factors, ok then.

[fall]

The system is about regulations, not emotions.

Could have fooled me.

[fall]

Kinda reminds me of a handful people here

I don't think anyone has made any formal complaints on here.

[Urban Cowboy]

FWIW you certainly aren't going to win much support with your tone.

[dogspoiler]

I'll trade noises, the worst racket around my place is slobs on bikes going back and forth to the bar.

[What_the]

The system is about regulations, not emotions.

Could have fooled me.

The aviation industry is the heaviest regulated by far. I only chimed in beyond my first post because you said you made a complaint to transport Canada with no satisfaction. I related my experience with transport Canada. I related that buoy markers, not to be confused with channel markers (red and green) are for optimal conditions. We all know or should that at times cautionary rules undercede safety and real life.
Finally, I mentioned whip and carrots.
Reporting what may be perceived as a transgression of regulations without satisfaction can, from my experience, be taken two ways- no transgression was made or the complainant put the human at the other end on the defensive and/or was rude.

No offence intended. Whip or carrot.

[GenesisGT]

Not talking about many sizes and types of planes taking off on the water, what water base have you spent many summers at? Not many float planes on Okanagan, and they are all roughly the same size. Could probably count them on one hand in Kelowna.
So we have you saying that calm waters require the most precise techniques and the other guy saying it is the wind amongst other factors, ok then.

Not that it matters but spent nine years around a busy water base in northern MB. Somerimes swamping, etc.

I can tell you noise that you get from the C180 and C185 that you get around Kelowna is nothing compared to the noise at an active base with single otters and beavers and twin otters, etc.

And from experience I can tell you that if the right information is logically provided to Transport Canada they will act up to and including license suspension and aircraft grounding.

As for wind, yes calm wind no waves provide a unique challenge, that some one who has not experienced it would not understand.

[dreamon]

For the record though, floatplanes and helicopters are not regulated by transport Canada, well at least there is no enforcement and they know it.
I am amazed there have been no crashes, yet.
I have noticed floatplanes increasingly flying well below what they should be.
The helicopters always have, nothing new there.

Before making such comments, you might want to familiarise yourself with CARS (focus on airspace types, then find the chart for the airspace around Kelowna), here is the link https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/acts-regulatio ... 96-433.htm

[dreamon]

I have watched the float planes coming and going from behind the Grand taxiing inside the bouys along the boardwalk several times, they can't even follow the rules there let alone in flight.

Refer to CARS for the rules before deciding if they are breaking them or not.
The buoys you refer to are not placed by TC for aircraft navigation.
Float planes (especially single engine & without reversing props) are awkward and cumbersome to manoeuvre when taxing at the best of times. They do not have brakes or reverse and carry a large sail (wing).
One of the rules of thumb for pilots is a priority list that is aviate, navigate, communicate. Taxiing on land or water fits that category. You taxi according to prevailing conditions.

[dreamon]

Yes, I contacted Valhala years ago, the receptionist was a cow and defensive right of the bat, denied that they even had an aircraft in the air at that time. Oh really, sent her a picture and said is this your blue and silver helicopter. Did a 180 on her story and went into defensive mode, extremely unprofessional. Alpine and Wilcat are very good and don't seem to have a problem quickly ascending and descending to 1000 feet before flying over homes.

All helicopter pilots (at least safe and alive ones) descend according to good aviation techniques. Valhalla, depending on wind conditions, approach and depart though the small natural valley whereby they are not directly over top of houses, or if they are, they have sufficient altitude and airspeed to auto to a safe area.

This link regarding deadman's curve will help you understand why they cannot descend directly. https://flightsafety.org/hs/hs_sep-oct90.pdf

Wildcat and Alpine predominately use twin engine machines which allows for a little more flexibility when it comes to deadman's curve. They also have singles, and when landing a single, they would descend less "quickly"

[fall]

Refer to CARS for the rules before deciding if they are breaking them or not.
The buoys you refer to are not placed by TC for aircraft navigation.
Float planes (especially single engine & without reversing props) are awkward and cumbersome to manoeuvre when taxing at the best of times. They do not have brakes or reverse and carry a large sail (wing).
One of the rules of thumb for pilots is a priority list that is aviate, navigate, communicate. Taxiing on land or water fits that category. You taxi according to prevailing conditions.

The buoys are placed there and mean nothing with a motor inside them. No boats, no aircraft. Pretty simple.
Maybe the planes I have seen just want to get their paying customers on tour a bit closer.

[fall]

All helicopter pilots (at least safe and alive ones) descend according to good aviation techniques. Valhalla, depending on wind conditions, approach and depart though the small natural valley whereby they are not directly over top of houses, or if they are, they have sufficient altitude and airspeed to auto to a safe area.

This link regarding deadman's curve will help you understand why they cannot descend directly. https://flightsafety.org/hs/hs_sep-oct90.pdf

Wildcat and Alpine predominately use twin engine machines which allows for a little more flexibility when it comes to deadman's curve. They also have singles, and when landing a single, they would descend less "quickly"

I get what they are supposed to do and the factors involved, trust me...doesn't happen that way all the time.
They certainly push the boundaries.

[fall]

Not that it matters but spent nine years around a busy water base in northern MB. Somerimes swamping, etc.

I can tell you noise that you get from the C180 and C185 that you get around Kelowna is nothing compared to the noise at an active base with single otters and beavers and twin otters, etc.

And from experience I can tell you that if the right information is logically provided to Transport Canada they will act up to and including license suspension and aircraft grounding.

As for wind, yes calm wind no waves provide a unique challenge, that some one who has not experienced it would not understand.

Noise is not my issue, it is altitude. I also just mentioned the float planes taxiing inside the buoys because I have seen that on several occasions and thought there is no reason for them to be doing so aside from being arrogant and having no regard for them being there for a reason.
I will have to get my good camera out and snap a few pictures next time a float plane skims my property while taking someone on a tour.