Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby spooker » Feb 11th, 2019, 11:29 am

Fancy wrote:The phrase "accidents happen" takes into consideration people aren't perfect - has nothing to do with fate. There are all sorts of variables that contributed to this horrible accident. The family will never be the same and they will be struggling for a long time.


An "accident" is, by definition, unintentional. We accidentally drop dinner plates, or send e-mails before we're done writing them. The word also suggests something of the unforeseen — an event that couldn't have been anticipated, for which no one can be blamed.


Sure, this event was not intentional ... but "accidents" are something minor ... when we speak about something that happens that is so violent that someone dies then we should use a word that grants it the power of that violence ... most of us will forget about an accident after the media cycles turns away ... but when we are forced to see a collision then it has a better chance to stay with us, maybe each time we get to that section of road we'll remember that Derek Flowers-Johnson lost his life here ...

The above quote was found at this location: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/08/24/when-a-car-crash-isnt-an-accident-and-why-the-difference-matters/
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby dle » Feb 11th, 2019, 11:34 am

LTD wrote:better center divider would have helped and driving according to the conditions would have helped if a semi hadn't been there at that exact moment it would have helped accidents do happen and this one is a sad story that I certainly wont forget


yes, seriously, why put a little speed bump of a median at all? Waste of money - if they are going to put a "safety" median on the highway, make it big enough to serve the purpose.

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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby lesliepaul » Feb 11th, 2019, 12:25 pm

There is no reason that overpass has to be there now with the tracks removed...……..knock it down and improve road safety at this horribly designed overpass location. Straighten the road out to better accommodate the 80 KPH speed limit and make the access to UBCO MUCH safer. As far as the "rail trail", run a culvert under the road or some other super cheap method. If this overpass remains it will no doubt require the usual expensive maintenance and to me that continuous expense FAR exceeds the rail trails value.
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby rookie314 » Feb 11th, 2019, 12:29 pm

I dare you to go 80. I went over it today in the right lane doing 90, being tailgated and passed by numerous cars in the left lane. Better Idea. put the cops out there ENFORCING!! the 80km speed limit.

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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby Fancy » Feb 11th, 2019, 1:07 pm

spooker wrote:Sure, this event was not intentional ... but "accidents" are something minor ..

Try another dictionary:

An unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally, typically resulting in damage or injury.

Oxford. Accidents can be major and the term is used in court documents.
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby dle » Feb 11th, 2019, 1:28 pm

rookie314 wrote:I dare you to go 80. I went over it today in the right lane doing 90, being tailgated and passed by numerous cars in the left lane. Better Idea. put the cops out there ENFORCING!! the 80km speed limit.


Might as well forget about anything being enforced around here.....it's jungle rules in Kelowna....
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby OKkayak » Feb 11th, 2019, 1:35 pm

spooker wrote:
Sure, this event was not intentional ... but "accidents" are something minor ... when we speak about something that happens that is so violent that someone dies then we should use a word that grants it the power of that violence ... most of us will forget about an accident after the media cycles turns away ... but when we are forced to see a collision then it has a better chance to stay with us, maybe each time we get to that section of road we'll remember that Derek Flowers-Johnson lost his life here ...

The above quote was found at this location: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/08/24/when-a-car-crash-isnt-an-accident-and-why-the-difference-matters/

Thats a biased opinion piece by someone who works for an organization to ban cars on streets (fitting that you would post it) and is not an accurate definition.
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby youjustcomplain » Feb 11th, 2019, 1:42 pm

I'm sick of reading peoples comments who simply look to lay blame.

A car and a truck hit and someone died. Of course there is more to it than that, but none of us, (unless you were involved in the accident reconstruction) know:
exactly what happened
who crossed the line
whether speed was involved by either party
whether the roads were adequately sanded
whether there was a mechanical failure
whether there were vehicle maintenance issues
whether the median was tall enough
whether the overpass is dangerous
whether the curve in the road was a factor
whether first responders did all they could
etc...


Can we just focus on the fact that someone died and stop looking for external reasons for it?

How do you think the road sanding crews feel if they read that the public is pointing at them as the reason for the kids death? Grow up people.

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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby GordonH » Feb 11th, 2019, 1:54 pm

lesliepaul wrote:There is no reason that overpass has to be there now with the tracks removed...……..knock it down and improve road safety at this horribly designed overpass location. Straighten the road out to better accommodate the 80 KPH speed limit and make the access to UBCO MUCH safer. As far as the "rail trail", run a culvert under the road or some other super cheap method. If this overpass remains it will no doubt require the usual expensive maintenance and to me that continuous expense FAR exceeds the rail trails value.


By trying to straightening that stretch of highway out would be huge expense. Okay remove the train underpass, then there is replacing the UBCO overpass.
Is it worth all the money just to remove train underpass & straightening out hwy 97.
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby dle » Feb 11th, 2019, 2:04 pm

youjustcomplain wrote:I'm sick of reading peoples comments who simply look to lay blame.

A car and a truck hit and someone died. Of course there is more to it than that, but none of us, (unless you were involved in the accident reconstruction) know:
exactly what happened
who crossed the line
whether speed was involved by either party
whether the roads were adequately sanded
whether there was a mechanical failure
whether there were vehicle maintenance issues
whether the median was tall enough
whether the overpass is dangerous
whether the curve in the road was a factor
whether first responders did all they could
etc...


Can we just focus on the fact that someone died and stop looking for external reasons for it?

How do you think the road sanding crews feel if they read that the public is pointing at them as the reason for the kids death? Grow up people.




Well, fact is, as tragic as these horrid accidents are, there are usually some legitimate reasons for the event occurring, or safeguards failing, that translate to a bit of blame all around. What comes of it, hopefully, is that it brings about positive changes so it lessens the chances of a terrible thing happening again.

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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby youjustcomplain » Feb 11th, 2019, 3:21 pm

dle wrote:Well, fact is, as tragic as these horrid accidents are, there are usually some legitimate reasons for the event occurring, or safeguards failing, that translate to a bit of blame all around. What comes of it, hopefully, is that it brings about positive changes so it lessens the chances of a terrible thing happening again.


Ok, so investigators may be able to point to one or a few contributing factors that lead to an accident. This information may never be passed down to the Castanet forums.
The wounds are still pretty fresh. Pointing fingers doesn't serve to improve anything. I'm really glad I haven't read any comments blaming the driver of either vehicle, yet.

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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby Jonrox » Feb 11th, 2019, 3:49 pm

spooker wrote:Over 4 people die in Canada every day in traffic collisions each day ... is that low enough that the rest of us can live with it?

I think it probably is low enough. I'm not really sure what the alternative is or what solution would actually be viable to lower this number considerably.
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby Anonymous123 » Feb 11th, 2019, 3:50 pm

youjustcomplain wrote:I'm sick of reading peoples comments who simply look to lay blame.

A car and a truck hit and someone died. Of course there is more to it than that, but none of us, (unless you were involved in the accident reconstruction) know:
exactly what happened
who crossed the line
whether speed was involved by either party
whether the roads were adequately sanded
whether there was a mechanical failure
whether there were vehicle maintenance issues
whether the median was tall enough
whether the overpass is dangerous
whether the curve in the road was a factor
whether first responders did all they could
etc...


Can we just focus on the fact that someone died and stop looking for external reasons for it?

How do you think the road sanding crews feel if they read that the public is pointing at them as the reason for the kids death? Grow up people.


You’re not complaining about people’s comments are you?
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby spooker » Feb 12th, 2019, 2:46 am

Fancy wrote:
spooker wrote:Sure, this event was not intentional ... but "accidents" are something minor ..

Try another dictionary:

An unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally, typically resulting in damage or injury.

Oxford. Accidents can be major and the term is used in court documents.


What happens will happen, nobody meant to do it so we don't have to do anything to do better ... the term is pervasive and used everywhere ... when do we take responsibility for doing more? A larger median might have saved a life here but how many people would cry over the millions of dollars that would require ... safety has to start with us continuing to learn to do better

Too many "accidents" happen, are briefly covered with very speculative descriptions by the reporting media ... and then go away ... we don't know what caused it, we don't get to learn from other people's mistakes ...

OKKayak wrote:Thats a biased opinion piece by someone who works for an organization to ban cars on streets (fitting that you would post it) and is not an accurate definition.


What would you consider an accurate definition? And framing Transportation Alternatives as wanting to "ban" cars is applying a slant to it that serves your own purpose ... the idea is to give importance to other modes while trying to put cars in perspective ... currently they consume a huge portion of our taxes and while they offer convenience we're starting to understand the true cost of that ... cars can't go away, but we can change how we view them ...
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Re: Last week's accident by UBCO turnoff....

Postby OKkayak » Feb 12th, 2019, 3:04 am

spooker wrote:What would you consider an accurate definition?

Fancy already provided it.
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