Alternatives to Wet Facilities

[pieinthei]

[MalaPropina]

There is no easy answer. This is just me spiralling here...

This system we currently have of coddling and enabling is clearly not working but you can't lock them up of force them into treatment either.

We could put a good dent in the "homeless criminal junkie" population that is occupying these facilities by having actual consequences for these people. You break the law, you go to jail just like any other citizen of this country. While in jail if you show a willingness to get clean and get treatment for your issues maybe for a reduced sentence. Get out, stay clean and THEN you can live in these no longer wet facilities being built. Stay clean for X amount of time and maybe that qualifies you for job training or education upgrading. Fail a drug test and you're done. You lose your apartment, the food, the support (both financial and emotional).

As for the ones that aren't criminal.... the mental health system needs to do more. Identify the ones truly in need. We need mental health facilities. Real medical facilities not institutions where they are locked up and forgotten about. Have similar rewards in place for the compilation of treatment and staying clean. Same consequences if you fail

A system of consequences but also support and rewards for those who genuinely want to get on a different path and stay on it.

[pieinthei]

This system we currently have of coddling and enabling is clearly not working but you can't lock them up of force them into treatment either.

QUESTION: WHY, why can't we lock them up.. the criminal junkies (not the truly homeless).. criminals belong in jail, no?
criminals do not belong in general population to run wild and wreak havoc, much less be rewarded with homes, food, needles and a place to store all their stolen goods.. makes no sense, if we are going to support their sorry a es anyways, why can't it be on OUR terms?

[MalaPropina]

This system we currently have of coddling and enabling is clearly not working but you can't lock them up of force them into treatment either.

QUESTION: WHY, why can't we lock them up.. the criminal junkies (not the truly homeless).. criminals belong in jail, no?
criminals do not belong in general population to run wild and wreak havoc, much less be rewarded with homes, food, needles and a place to store all their stolen goods.. makes no sense, if we are going to support their sorry a es anyways, why can't it be on OUR terms?

If you read my whole post I did say to have real consequences (ie jail) for the criminal element.

The rest can't be forced into treatment as this country has laws about holding people against their will.

[pieinthei]

If you read my whole post I did say to have real consequences (ie jail) for the criminal element.

The rest can't be forced into treatment as this country has laws about holding people against their will.

don't get me wrong, i agree wholeheartedly with your entire post..
my opinion tho, although it may take a while, is if the laws aren't working, change them.. laws get changed, adjusted all the time, why not these..

[MalaPropina]

So..... locking people up against their will when they haven't committed a crime is something you support in a free country? That's a slippery slope indeed.

Other than Section 3 ( I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) of the Mental Health Act, they can't hold anyone more than 72 hours.

[voice of reason]

So..... locking people up against their will when they haven't committed a crime is something you support in a free country? That's a slippery slope indeed.

Other than Section 3 ( I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) of the Mental Health Act, they can't hold anyone more than 72 hours.

drugs are illegal. it wouldnt be hard to rack up some charges on a drug addict. catch them shoplifting/stealing or whatever and charge them with a count for every item they have stolen.charge them for the drugs stashed in their sock.charge them for possessing a crack pipe,charge them if they have anything that can be used as a weapon on them .charge them if they have break and enter tools. a simple catch and release theft charge just turned into a laundry list of charges now make them go to court for all charges. if they get arrested again while waiting for the trial then off to jail you go until your court date.its not hard. this is pretty much how they cleaned up times square in NYC back in the day. i do not agree with holding someone who hasnt committed a crime but we are talking about people who commit crimes daily.stop them for suspicion and search them. the bike they are riding is stolen.everything in their backpack is stolen.if they really wanted to crack down on crime and clean up this mess it wouldnt be hard. the problem is no one seems to want to get off their *bleep* and do anything about it. they are all scared of looking like the bad guy

[pieinthei]

So..... locking people up against their will when they haven't committed a crime is something you support in a free country? That's a slippery slope indeed.

Other than Section 3 ( I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) of the Mental Health Act, they can't hold anyone more than 72 hours.

i am 100% in favor of locking up criminals.. that's what jails are made for. as far as mental health patients, unfortunately Riverview was shut down (mistake). And as i have said, REAL homeless people have my support when needed.. its the criminal (junkies) that i have the biggest issue with.. lock em up, they are criminals. or put em on a one way ferry to ... wherever (rattlesnake island)

[humphriey]

EVERYONE needs to watch "Seattle is Dying" on Youtube.
This documentary shows the utter decay of Seattle due to drug addiction. It resembles what every city is going through these days. It is terrifying, frustrating, maddening and sad.
The state and city politicians have all but buried their heads in the sand.
There is a SOLUTION, and it's working!!! 93% SUCCESS RATE!!!
Providence Rhode Island has implemented a MANDATORY
program in prison. The "MAT" (Medication Assisted Treatment) program has some 30 year heroin users now able to hold a job and support themselves.
We need "TOUGH LOVE" to solve this problem. We are currently throwing millions of dollars at addiction issues, yet the problem gets worse on a daily basis.
Our Judicial system must stop the "Catch and Release" circus and get a MAT program started!

[Country plough boy]

I suggest those who want more assistance for junkies. Could easily go down Hein road or Leon with a wad of 20s. Hand em out. Make it rain. You will make a lot of friends. Help a lot of needy folks. Best of all. Those ppl you help. Will not be out stealing. It is a selfless good deed to buy a junkie dope . You will feel so good about it.

If you are not willing to put your money where your mouth is. I personally would be ok with any solution that gives us our town back. Without providing one cent of a leg up for these junkies.

[alanjh595]

So..... locking people up against their will when they haven't committed a crime is something you support in a free country? That's a slippery slope indeed.

Other than Section 3 ( I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) of the Mental Health Act, they can't hold anyone more than 72 hours.

Holding a junkie for 72 hours could be considered 2 different ways, and it depends upon which side of the fence you are sitting on.
#1. To deprive a junkie of his "medication", is cruel and unusual punishment. That lack of that medication will most likely cause that person to act out and become agitated/aggressive towards authority/others. That would/could lead to further criminal charges of violence.
#2. Any person that is taken into a Mental Health hold, must be treated as a "sick" person.

The standard criteria for placing a person under an involuntary psychiatric hold is that the individual must either be a danger to themselves, a danger to others or suffer from a grave disability as a result of a mental illness. Gravely disabled persons are admitted involuntarily when they are mentally incapable of providing for their own basic needs and are either deteriorating quickly or unable to be cared for by loved ones. Someone is considered a danger to themselves if they have acted in ways that indicate a lack of self-control, judgment and overall ability to satisfy their basic needs.

Medical professionals are real good at determining the differences between medical, psychological and pharmacological causes.

[alanjh595]

I suggest those who want more assistance for junkies. Could easily go down Hein road or Leon with a wad of 20s. Hand em out. Make it rain. You will make a lot of friends. Help a lot of needy folks. Best of all. Those ppl you help. Will not be out stealing. It is a selfless good deed to buy a junkie dope . You will feel so good about it.

If you are not willing to put your money where your mouth is. I personally would be ok with any solution that gives us our town back. Without providing one cent of a leg up for these junkies.

Why would you say that? It is so terribly wrong, that I can't even begin to comment without using multiple superlatives. As much as I hate the drugs and what they do to people, and our society, even I couldn't post such a bunch of drivel.

[Country plough boy]

I suggest those who want more assistance for junkies. Could easily go down Hein road or Leon with a wad of 20s. Hand em out. Make it rain. You will make a lot of friends. Help a lot of needy folks. Best of all. Those ppl you help. Will not be out stealing. It is a selfless good deed to buy a junkie dope . You will feel so good about it.

If you are not willing to put your money where your mouth is. I personally would be ok with any solution that gives us our town back. Without providing one cent of a leg up for these junkies.

Why would you say that? It is so terribly wrong, that I can't even begin to comment without using multiple superlatives. As much as I hate the drugs and what they do to people, and our society, even I couldn't post such a bunch of drivel.

So go hand out your cash then. What are you waiting for. U wanna help ppl or not

[alanjh595]

I suggest those who want more assistance for junkies. Could easily go down Hein road or Leon with a wad of 20s. Hand em out. Make it rain. You will make a lot of friends. Help a lot of needy folks. Best of all. Those ppl you help. Will not be out stealing. It is a selfless good deed to buy a junkie dope . You will feel so good about it.

If you are not willing to put your money where your mouth is. I personally would be ok with any solution that gives us our town back. Without providing one cent of a leg up for these junkies.

Why would you say that? It is so terribly wrong, that I can't even begin to comment without using multiple superlatives. As much as I hate the drugs and what they do to people, and our society, even I couldn't post such a bunch of drivel.

So go hand out your cash then. What are you waiting for. U wanna help ppl or not

Anyone that make such ludicrous statements and then back them up with other similar opinions has no interest in being part of a solution, and just wants to create disdain. That's Okay, we see you for what you really are......a troll.

In Internet slang, a troll is a person who starts quarrels or upsets people on the Internet to distract and sow discord by posting inflammatory and digressive,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses[2] and normalizing tangential discussion,[3] whether for the troll's amusement or a specific gain.

You have shown your hand, and now everyone can see what you really are.

[cutter7]

So..... locking people up against their will when they haven't committed a crime is something you support in a free country? That's a slippery slope indeed.

Other than Section 3 ( I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) of the Mental Health Act, they can't hold anyone more than 72 hours.

Holding a junkie for 72 hours could be considered 2 different ways, and it depends upon which side of the fence you are sitting on.
#1. To deprive a junkie of his "medication", is cruel and unusual punishment. That lack of that medication will most likely cause that person to act out and become agitated/aggressive towards authority/others. That would/could lead to further criminal charges of violence.
#2. Any person that is taken into a Mental Health hold, must be treated as a "sick" person.

The standard criteria for placing a person under an involuntary psychiatric hold is that the individual must either be a danger to themselves, a danger to others or suffer from a grave disability as a result of a mental illness. Gravely disabled persons are admitted involuntarily when they are mentally incapable of providing for their own basic needs and are either deteriorating quickly or unable to be cared for by loved ones. Someone is considered a danger to themselves if they have acted in ways that indicate a lack of self-control, judgment and overall ability to satisfy their basic needs.

Medical professionals are real good at determining the differences between medical, psychological and pharmacological causes.

Holding a junkie for 72 hrs may be cruel punishment but it is also common practice for law enforcement to hold a junkie until they are dope sick enough to rat out .

I agree with the poster who says anyone who commits a crime should be charged and held responsible.
Enough with this catch and release program