Slide event

Slide event

Postby GordonH » Jan 11th, 2021, 8:54 pm

I suspect this homeowner is having a very nervous evening, plus checking the insurance policy.
https://www.castanet.net/news/Kelowna/3 ... ss-a-slide
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Re: Slide event

Postby Mrmarvingardens » Jan 11th, 2021, 10:40 pm

Any guess that if it affects any homes, the city will say...oops..not our problem.
Does anyone remember a number of years ago, the houses that slid at Kelowna's north end?
Initial response from city officials was accepting no responsibility, although they finally paid the owners who lost their homes. No more homes built on the hillside.

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Re: Slide event

Postby Palliser » Jan 11th, 2021, 10:46 pm

That area is called Marshall Heights originally...named after the old Kelowna family called the Marshall Family. NOt without development controversy. IIRC they messed up the Conservatory development and it sat as an eye sore on glenmore for 10 years and then built that whole area and there was complaints it had significant drainage problems. I maybe wrong but that is how i remember it.

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Re: Slide event

Postby Frisk » Jan 11th, 2021, 11:19 pm

That one pine tree tryna hold up the entire slope. Yikes

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Re: Slide event

Postby lesliepaul » Jan 11th, 2021, 11:26 pm

Mrmarvingardens wrote:Any guess that if it affects any homes, the city will say...oops..not our problem.
Does anyone remember a number of years ago, the houses that slid at Kelowna's north end?
Initial response from city officials was accepting no responsibility, although they finally paid the owners who lost their homes. No more homes built on the hillside.


This city reacts the same way EVERYTIME when something like this happens.......blame everybody else. Big rush to approve anything developers want, then when these developments have SERIOUS problems because of the City of Kelowna being too stupid too read the topography of much of the area with any common sense.........the homeowners problem!

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Re: Slide event

Postby TylerM4 » Jan 12th, 2021, 9:38 am

lesliepaul wrote:This city reacts the same way EVERYTIME when something like this happens.......blame everybody else. Big rush to approve anything developers want, then when these developments have SERIOUS problems because of the City of Kelowna being too stupid too read the topography of much of the area with any common sense.........the homeowners problem!


Lol. I know you want to hate on the city, but C'mon. It's not as simple as reading a topo map. This slope has unstable soil, that's not something that shows up on a topography map. Many many homes in Kelowna built on similar topography without an issue.
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Re: Slide event

Postby JJetson65 » Jan 12th, 2021, 9:49 am

That dirt was brought in for that area of houses - it was a slope originally by Mother Nature - I have been waiting for that slope to slide - In every area around Knox where they push dirt in to build on, slopes have slid. End of Mountain Ave near Knox, years ago 2 or 3 houses slid - they even tried repairing - but down they came - the slope underneath Royal View houses bordering Knox - it has been moving ever since AND the road itself, Royal view has been repaired as it is pulling in the middle, you can see the hump in the middle of that road. If its not rock or some kind of extraordinary Allen block / Cement block retainer wall, its coming down. With the weather over the next few days, should be interesting to watch that slope....... lived in this neighbourhood for over 40 years...

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Re: Slide event

Postby Anonymous123 » Jan 12th, 2021, 11:48 am

I’ll wait and see, but I wouldn’t rule out a water leak somewhere.
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Re: Slide event

Postby cv23 » Jan 12th, 2021, 11:50 am

It's not as simple as reading a topo map. This slope has unstable soil, that's not something that shows up on a topography map. Many many homes in Kelowna built on similar topography without an issue.


That is because prior to any development the City demands a geotech survey for such lots to show they are stable enough to build on. Once the City reviews the geotech survey the City deems it acceptable and after payment the City issues a development permit. After further review by City staff the City then collects more money for approval of a building permit. The City monitors all phases of construction. The City inspects that things are built as the City has specified and approved. The City then issues an occupancy permit.
The City is there with their hands out for money to give approvals from the time a building lot is even planned right through to occupancy of a home yet when there is an issue the City is the first to try and wash their hands of the entire matter.

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Re: Slide event

Postby one wheel » Jan 12th, 2021, 1:16 pm

I've watched slides happen in Kelowna for years but it keeps continuing because the City encourages development.

In March of 2019 Kirschner Mountain had a slide problem & the cost to repair it was estimated at 1.2 million but that problem isn't in our news anymore ?

When a problem occurs everybody scurries away & points their finger towards it being approved & they did nothing wrong ?

I think these slides have only started to show themselves due to what's been allowed ?

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Re: Slide event

Postby JJetson65 » Jan 12th, 2021, 2:36 pm

Anonymous123 wrote:I’ll wait and see, but I wouldn’t rule out a water leak somewhere.


Well there is a pool in that backyard...... I thought that too, coupled with no support on the cliff side..... yikes
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Re: Slide event

Postby TylerM4 » Jan 12th, 2021, 4:22 pm

cv23 wrote:
That is because prior to any development the City demands a geotech survey for such lots to show they are stable enough to build on. Once the City reviews the geotech survey the City deems it acceptable and after payment the City issues a development permit. After further review by City staff the City then collects more money for approval of a building permit. The City monitors all phases of construction. The City inspects that things are built as the City has specified and approved. The City then issues an occupancy permit.
The City is there with their hands out for money to give approvals from the time a building lot is even planned right through to occupancy of a home yet when there is an issue the City is the first to try and wash their hands of the entire matter.



That's only sorta how it works. The city approves the development permit. That permit does not consider soil conditions, etc unless it's an area that has been specifically marked/zoned as "unstable soil".

But the construction within that development is all subject to building permit process. The building permit process is very formal. If a geotech signs off on it, then it's approved. City of Kelowna says "Here's the rules/requirements" if a building permit meets those rules/requirements it's approved - there is no "Actually, we don't think that's a good idea" process built in. If COK tried to do such a thing, they'd get their *bleep* sued off. If you meet the requirements you can build, if you don't you can't build - it's as simple as that. Building inspections do just that - they ensure you are building to the published requirements only. If there isn't a requirement in black and white in the building code, COK cannot force you to do it (or not do it).

Long story short - Geotechnical engineer evaluated and approved this slope, not anyone at COK. Either the geotech screwed up, or whomever built didn't follow geotech's instructions (eg - used wrong soil to backfill, built the slope steeper than designed/approved, forgot to put in the required drainage, or flat out left it as a natural slope when the design called for retaining wall).

Again - You guys want to hate on COK but this isn't their responsibility and they'd get sued if they tried to intervene with requirements not captured in building code.
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Re: Slide event

Postby Anonymous123 » Jan 12th, 2021, 4:41 pm

Not sure if it’s fixed or not, but if you go up into the Royal Pine area, just above the slide that was occurring behind Knox Mountain Metals, you will find a slight stream of water that is now finding its way into the storm drain. Could be an underground stream or a leak somewhere. Just saying’.
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Re: Slide event

Postby Vacancyrate » Jan 12th, 2021, 4:50 pm

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Re: Slide event

Postby cv23 » Jan 12th, 2021, 7:03 pm

That's only sorta how it works. The city approves the development permit. That permit does not consider soil conditions, etc unless it's an area that has been specifically marked/zoned as "unstable soil".

But the construction within that development is all subject to building permit process. The building permit process is very formal. If a geotech signs off on it, then it's approved. City of Kelowna says "Here's the rules/requirements" if a building permit meets those rules/requirements it's approved - there is no "Actually, we don't think that's a good idea" process built in. If COK tried to do such a thing, they'd get their *bleep* sued off. If you meet the requirements you can build, if you don't you can't build - it's as simple as that. Building inspections do just that - they ensure you are building to the published requirements only. If there isn't a requirement in black and white in the building code, COK cannot force you to do it (or not do it).

Long story short - Geotechnical engineer evaluated and approved this slope, not anyone at COK. Either the geotech screwed up, or whomever built didn't follow geotech's instructions (eg - used wrong soil to backfill, built the slope steeper than designed/approved, forgot to put in the required drainage, or flat out left it as a natural slope when the design called for retaining wall).

Again - You guys want to hate on COK but this isn't their responsibility and they'd get sued if they tried to intervene with requirements not captured in building code.


If the CoK did not require a geotech survey for development and building permits on a steep slope on the side of a mountain as in this case then then they take on a large portion the liability. The BC Building code outlines clear requirements for building on slopes and those requirements increase with the percentage of slope. The CoK's is responsible to inspect and ensure all requirements of the BCBC are met before issuing an occupancy permit.
If there was a geotech report it would clearly outline the recommendations/requirements for development/construction at that specific location (engineers cover their butts to the max). The CoK would have issued permits based on and including that report. The CoK would then have inspected that the requirements were indeed followed as they formed part of the permit.
If as suggested above someone didn't follow the geotech reports requirements or the BCBC then the CoK is again liable for not catching the deficiencies and issuing an occupancy permit for the premises.

FYI: The CoK turns down development and building permits all the time and can demand a geotech report anytime they want.
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