Crane collapse downtown

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cv23
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by cv23 »

nucksRnum1 wrote:
Its time to go back to unions where training was deemed valuable
Sadly unionized labor is longer a guarantee of anything, except possible labor unrest.
Training is done by colleges and trade schools not unions. Safety is taught and enforced by the government (Worksafe) not unions.
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cv23
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by cv23 »

featfan wrote: I watched them pounding the trees in the ground.
Do not care if you believe me or not.
You may have watched things (steel columns) pounded in the ground but guaranteed it wasn't trees. Lumber of the size and grade required for foundation columns to be pounded into the ground is far to valuable to be used simply to rot underground and steel is more readily available, stronger, doesn't rot is also far cheaper. Developers are all about saving money not spending it so when it comes to foundation columns steel is the material of choice and has been for decades.
TylerM4
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by TylerM4 »

nucksRnum1 wrote: Jul 28th, 2021, 2:37 pm Its time to go back to unions where training was deemed valuable
I suspect you're not speaking from a position of experience or knowledge here. There are a lot of unionized tradesmen out there. No different for them. In fact - unionized employers are a big part of the problem. Most unionized shops simply don't bring in apprentices at all.

I have a lot of experience working in unionized environments. Never seen them advocate for additional training unless they're trying to force additional pay at the same time. What I have seen them do is actively fight AGAINST things like additional certifications/training. Trying to bring in a student to complete a co-op work term is darn near impossible in a unionized environment with a few specific exceptions (healthcare/nursing comes to mind).
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by TylerM4 »

cv23 wrote: Jul 28th, 2021, 3:19 pm You may have watched things (steel columns) pounded in the ground but guaranteed it wasn't trees. Lumber of the size and grade required for foundation columns to be pounded into the ground is far to valuable to be used simply to rot underground and steel is more readily available, stronger, doesn't rot is also far cheaper. Developers are all about saving money not spending it so when it comes to foundation columns steel is the material of choice and has been for decades.
Yup. Anyone with experience in construction industry will immediately understand how unlikely that scenario is.

To take it a step further. Organic material of any kind is expressly NOT ALLOWED under a foundation. Inspectors look for any evidence of such and won't pass a site if it's seen. You can't so much as build a garage on top of a tree root much less a tower on an entire tree.
Tankur
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by Tankur »

TylerM4 wrote: Jul 28th, 2021, 9:12 am
Tankur wrote: Jul 24th, 2021, 3:32 pm
I did the plumbing apprenticeship. Problem working for companies in town. None of the journeymen want to teach. None of the companies want to lose
Good workers to school. I was a 2nd year for almost 5 years. I watched a lot come through and only be allowed to do one task. Drill holes. No touching or running any pipe. Until a 3rd or competent 4th year. Ita is a joke.
Well recognized in any trades program that the apprentices get the worst jobs. They consider it "paying your dues". Every journeyman you came across had to go through the same thing themselves. Apprentices are there to make the company money 1st - It's not a charity operation and teaching isn't their job or priority despite what the schools tell you. It's not that they don't want to lose them to school. It's the simple fact that apprentices are flighty as all heck. No company is going to invest in a lot of training for a 1st or 2nd year apprentice who very likely will not end up working for them after graduation. MANY apprentices attend a trades program in the Okanagan, do their apprenticing in the Okanagan - and as soon as they get their journeyman ticket they head up north or elsewhere chasing the big bucks. I don't blame these companies one bit for being reluctant to invest in an apprentice when there's a good chance that investment will go on to benefit some other company.

Honestly - it sounds to me like your expectations weren't rooted in reality.
My expectations after starting an apprenticeship, we’re to be a confident journeyman at the end. Nothing else but that. Trades programs are not set up for that. 1st and 2nd years do not make the company any money what so ever. I feel as if you know nothing on the subject. If you would like I can give you the rundown.
stuphoto
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by stuphoto »

I don't know about now, but many years ago a first year apprentice made 50% of a journeyman and was more or less a helper learning the ins and outs.
If they got lucky they would sort of get adopted by a journeyman as their persional assistant and learn the skills quicker and more efficient.
The second and third years would get paid more, develop their skills further and have more responsibi.lity
Ranger67
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by Ranger67 »

featfan wrote: Jul 28th, 2021, 3:07 pm I watched them pounding the trees in the ground.
Do not care if you believe me or not
It is quite possible that you saw them pounding "logs" into the ground but it was more likely for shoring then structural support.
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by featfan »

They only put them where the tower sits. Then brought in fill and then a specialized waterproofing material for the whole site and a few meters up the sides. Then came the rebar and the concrete slab.
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by Ranger67 »

Probably for the elevator core, I believe they had some very robust water issues at this site and actually poured an active pump (water) into the pour to maintain the levels.
Scrobins94
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by Scrobins94 »

Any updates? Are they back to work?
Scrobins94
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by Scrobins94 »

Would be great if someone could help pay this fine, to lessen the burden on the family.

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6125858

Feel sorry for the family. :cry:
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Anonymous123
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by Anonymous123 »

Scrobins94 wrote: Aug 3rd, 2021, 10:11 pm Would be great if someone could help pay this fine, to lessen the burden on the family.

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6125858

Feel sorry for the family. :cry:
The MP for the Salmon Arm area should be stepping up to sort this out.
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Tankur
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by Tankur »

What a complete joke that fine is. The whole Covid issue with travelling …tell me it’s not about money to the govt of Canada. Absolutely brutal and disheartening to read this .
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Anonymous123
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

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nucksRnum1
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Re: Crane collapse downtown

Post by nucksRnum1 »

Question. Saw a clip where there were 4 bouquet wraps of flowers. Considering that 1 civilian died - is it just me - or is that an insult to an innocent bystander?

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