Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

[Urban Cowboy]

Ah .. the Kangaroo court of Castanet ..

Wait for the results of the investigation , M'kay ?

If it were any of you "naysayers" being speculated about , how would you feel ?


You ARE being accused of killing FOUR people ................

Uhuh.......... a Kangaroo court whose speculation is based on multiple news stories, an account from a former news anchor at CHBC who was on the bus owned by the same company, that got into an incident just a day or so prior, and the knowledge that our government held a news conference warning people to stay off the highways due to the extreme conditions present.

Sorry but that's not my definition of a Kangaroo court.

The simple fact that bus was even on the road demonstrates the negligent tendencies of the vehicles owners, and lack of regard for their human cargo.

They should be shut down now until an investigation proves they weren't negligent and deserve to operate in BC, or should we wait for a third bus of theirs to crash?

[Saviour]

an account from a former news anchor at CHBC who was on the bus owned by the same company, that got into an incident just a day or so prior

The first incident involved BlueStar Coachlines which subcontracts on behalf of Ebus utilizing their own coaches and drivers.

[Urban Cowboy]

an account from a former news anchor at CHBC who was on the bus owned by the same company, that got into an incident just a day or so prior

The first incident involved BlueStar Coachlines which subcontracts on behalf of Ebus.

So running for the same company in other words. Semantics? The blurb I read that day said Ebus.

Our officials are also calling it the same company..........

British Columbia's transport minister says investigators looking into a bus crash that claimed four lives on the Okanagan Connector road on Christmas Eve are also considering another crash involving the same operator days earlier.

Many couriers as an example own their own trucks, but they work under one umbrella be it Loomis, DHL, Purolator, or Ace. They are all generally told what to do by the management of the banner they are working under.

[Saviour]

So running for the same company in other words. Semantics.

Operating on behalf of and owned by the same company is more than semantics. If you book a ticket through Air Canada, with an Air Canada flight number, ticket, etc. but you fly on United Airlines and they have an accident, do you pull parallels with Air Canada because they issued the ticket or with United because they provided the service?

Hiring practices can be very different between the two companies as well as operating procedures. The added pressure for the subcontractor of potential of financial or contractual repercussions from the vendor if the the third party does not deliver the services required is also possible.

[MAPearce]

The simple fact that bus was even on the road demonstrates the negligent tendencies of the vehicles owners, and lack of regard for their human cargo.

Uh huh .. Lets go BACK ...

The bus was mostly FULL because people wanted to go where they WANTED to ... And PAID , accepted the risk and got on board ..

Blame the bus driver or company ? .. Get stuffed

[Saviour]

The blurb I read that day said Ebus.

Our officials are also calling it the same company..........

British Columbia's transport minister says investigators looking into a bus crash that claimed four lives on the Okanagan Connector road on Christmas Eve are also considering another crash involving the same operator days earlier.

Ebus (parent company Pacific Western Transportation which operates several divisions including Diversified) was involved in so much as the service was operating on behalf of them.

https://vancouver.citynews.ca/2022/12/2 ... t-company/

The couple says the bus they were in belonged to BlueStar Coachlines, but it was Ebus that did the ticketing and made the travel arrangements.

Speaking with CityNews on Sunday, the president of Ebus, John Stepovy says the bus in the Dec. 20 incident did not belong to the company but was contracted out to BlueStar Coachlines.

“In a busy holiday travel season, we work with partners to provide extra schedules for us,” he said.

[Urban Cowboy]

The simple fact that bus was even on the road demonstrates the negligent tendencies of the vehicles owners, and lack of regard for their human cargo.

Uh huh .. Lets go BACK ...

The bus was mostly FULL because people wanted to go where they WANTED to ... And PAID , accepted the risk and got on board ..

Blame the bus driver or company ? .. Get stuffed

So I wonder who the deceased's surviving dependents are going to sue if not the bus driver or company?

I guess time will tell whose logic will prevail.

Get stuffed? Still got your mind on turkey I see.



ETA: BTW Gordon Vizutti mentioned their driver seemingly driving fast for conditions, having a close encounter which caused him to swerve suddenly and then ask the riders if they were OK, to which the response was we'd be better if you drove slower, failing to take the hint, this driver shortly after clipped a semi truck, but noooooooooooooo........................ let's not blame the driver.

[captkirkcanada]

Ah .. the Kangaroo court of Castanet ..

Wait for the results of the investigation , M'kay ?

If it were any of you "naysayers" being speculated about , how would you feel ?


You ARE being accused of killing FOUR people ................

Uhuh.......... a Kangaroo court whose speculation is based on multiple news stories, an account from a former news anchor at CHBC who was on the bus owned by the same company, that got into an incident just a day or so prior, and the knowledge that our government held a news conference warning people to stay off the highways due to the extreme conditions present.

Sorry but that's not my definition of a Kangaroo court.

The simple fact that bus was even on the road demonstrates the negligent tendencies of the vehicles owners, and lack of regard for their human cargo.

They should be shut down now until an investigation proves they weren't negligent and deserve to operate in BC, or should we wait for a third bus of theirs to crash?

Which is a big part of what the police and or transport canada will base alot of their findings on besides the numbers of speed , braking if any , steering inputs if any and how it came to rest on its side .

First hand accounts are crucial as you pointed out .

[Fancy]

Unfortunately so many terrible stories will arise from these deaths. And we're seeing it on the news now from finding cell phones to hearing panic and questions because of that. People have to know travelling at this time of year comes with risks. But no one wants the worst outcome. Most will reach their destination - some with colourful stories - but some will not. Tragic.

[MAPearce]

Uh huh .. Lets go BACK ...

The bus was mostly FULL because people wanted to go where they WANTED to ... And PAID , accepted the risk and got on board ..

Blame the bus driver or company ? .. Get stuffed

So I wonder who the deceased's surviving dependents are going to sue if not the bus driver or company?

I guess time will tell whose logic will prevail.

Get stuffed? Still got your mind on turkey I see.



ETA: BTW Gordon Vizutti mentioned their driver seemingly driving fast for conditions, having a close encounter which caused him to swerve suddenly and then ask the riders if they were OK, to which the response was we'd be better if you drove slower, failing to take the hint, this driver shortly after clipped a semi truck, but noooooooooooooo........................ let's not blame the driver.

So .. Gord Vizutti IGNORED travel advisories and chose to take a bus ?? Go on ....

NOOOOOOO . Blame the driver ..

[Urban Cowboy]

So I wonder who the deceased's surviving dependents are going to sue if not the bus driver or company?

I guess time will tell whose logic will prevail.

Get stuffed? Still got your mind on turkey I see.



ETA: BTW Gordon Vizutti mentioned their driver seemingly driving fast for conditions, having a close encounter which caused him to swerve suddenly and then ask the riders if they were OK, to which the response was we'd be better if you drove slower, failing to take the hint, this driver shortly after clipped a semi truck, but noooooooooooooo........................ let's not blame the driver.

So .. Gord Vizutti IGNORED travel advisories and chose to take a bus ?? Go on ....

NOOOOOOO . Blame the driver ..

That ministry of transport news conference concerned with freezing rain and ice conditions happened after Gordon's bus ride, but before the second crash. Winter road condition warnings have been happening for several weeks, and happen every winter so those aren't really new. The news conference was new and not the norm.

I actually wondered if that news release wasn't prompted by the first bus crash.

[MAPearce]

So .. Gord Vizutti IGNORED travel advisories and chose to take a bus ?? Go on ....

NOOOOOOO . Blame the driver ..

That ministry of transport news conference concerned with freezing rain and ice conditions happened after Gordon's bus ride, but before the second crash. Winter road condition warnings have been happening for several weeks, and happen every winter so those aren't really new. The news conference was new and not the norm.

I actually wondered if that news release wasn't prompted by the first bus crash.

Yeah .. but he was on a bus because the plane said NO ?

Don't tell me that anyone on "The Bus" wasn't looking for a way to get where they WANTED to go ...

And they blame the driver ??

Sad really

[Urban Cowboy]

That ministry of transport news conference concerned with freezing rain and ice conditions happened after Gordon's bus ride, but before the second crash. Winter road condition warnings have been happening for several weeks, and happen every winter so those aren't really new. The news conference was new and not the norm.

I actually wondered if that news release wasn't prompted by the first bus crash.

Yeah .. but he was on a bus because the plane said NO ?

Don't tell me that anyone on "The Bus" wasn't looking for a way to get where they WANTED to go ...

And they blame the driver ??

Sad really

OK seriously now, are you suggesting that simply because people who couldn't fly or lost their flights, and subsequently opted for a bus, they thereby agreed to a bus driver not driving to existing conditions?

I hardly think they would have cared, if the bus was only able to drive at 40kph, as long as they got to their destination in one piece, even if it was a few hours later than expected.

After all highways were being closed in various places on an off regardless, so drivers really had no way of knowing if they were going to face a delay or not, in fact advisories explicitly stated to be prepared for them.

That alone proves that speeding, or attempting to even do the speed limit, when not safe to do so was quite pointless.

Please remember that commercial vehicles such as buses, are held to a higher standard than a private vehicle, yet all can be liable to a charge of speeding, if road conditions were such that doing the speed limit was not safe.

Vizutti's statement certainly supports the notion that Ebus drivers tend to push the limits.

[Saviour]

The advisory was to avoid non-essential travel if possible; first off, it was an advisory, not a mandate. Second, public transportation is essential travel - the reasons why passengers are travelling may not be essential, but that is beyond subjective, regardless, the service provided is essential.

ETA: BTW Gordon Vizutti mentioned their driver seemingly driving fast for conditions, having a close encounter which caused him to swerve suddenly and then ask the riders if they were OK, to which the response was we'd be better if you drove slower, failing to take the hint, this driver shortly after clipped a semi truck, but noooooooooooooo........................ let's not blame the driver.

A passengers account can be very skewed in perspective, especially after a traumatic event. Things look very different if one is in the drivers seat versus sitting 30 feet back behind the driver.

Vizutti's statement certainly supports the notion that Ebus drivers tend to push the limits.

Because of one incident that he witnessed? Thats quite the broad brush. How many other incidents has Ebus or their parent company been involved in? And as explained before, the bus that Vizutti was travelling on was not driven by an Ebus driver nor was it an Ebus coach. Saying that Ebus drivers are "pushing the limits" because of an incident involving a different company is imprudent.

And they blame the driver ??

The bottom line is this, an accident is compromised of a series of events and factors, but at the end of the day, the driver is the one who makes a decision to proceed or not to proceed and what speed or manner he is driving in any given condition.

Every one is screaming "drive to the conditions", but none of us know what the conditions were at the time and they can change very quickly, for all we know, he could have been driving to the conditions and they changed rapidly and was adjusting his speed accordingly at the time of the accident. Perhaps he was driving to conditions, started nodding off and cranked the wheel as he panically woke up. We don't know.

[captkirkcanada]

That is true that conditions can change fast on that road , i can agree with that fact , but i think experianced winter drivers will say drive to the worst condotion as opposed to on the edge . Theres a prelim report out that is putting weight on the road conditions being dynamic , that the road changed between wet clear to frozen ice .

I think its safe to say that speed is what will catch a person by surprise and you have seconds to make the right manouver or its off for a ride uncontrolled .

I have to lean towards the better to be late and go as slow as you have to but im not a bus driver nor a traffic investigator .