Small-scale possession of illicit drugs will be decriminalized in B.C. starting next year

[captkirkcanada]

the information is out there for everyone, if people want to do drugs and become junkies that's on them, its not the govt responsibititly to help out everytime people deside to do stupied s hit

I can't speak for others, but for me I'm very concerned about drug addicts..... I'm concerned that they steal stuff, they take up valuable medical and first responder resources and they have destroyed certain area of many cities with their encampments.

I pay taxes and I feel that it is the government's responsibility to work toward solving those problems.

As for baby steps to solve the drug problem, the easiest and most cost effective first step would be get rid of Naloxone. Not everyone who is concerned with the drug problem is concerned about the addicts. [ this is promoting murder as a solution to a medical problem.] If drugs didn't affect the general population with the crime and costs to resources I couldn't care less what happened to addicts as a result of their decision to as you say, "do stupid "

yea well i feel same about drug users known as alcoholics. i feel they should be disappeared to the planet mars ,alcoholics cost canada way more than rest the drugs combined.


15 billion a year is no small amount

https://globalnews.ca/news/5060998/alco ... a-experts/

A report released in 2018 by the Canadian Centre on Substance Use and Addiction and the Canadian Institute for Substance Use Research estimated alcohol cost Canadians almost $15 billion per year in terms of lost productivity, justice costs, and more.

“You think, ‘Oh my gosh, we have this opioid crisis, we have this meth crisis,” said AFM’s Dr. Sherri Fandrey.
Seventy per cent of the costs to our Canadian society (are caused by) alcohol and tobacco. Alcohol recently overtook tobacco as the most costly, the most harmful substance we have in Canada.

so yea i agree we need to do something about alkies and soon .

[my5cents]

.....As for baby steps to solve the drug problem, the easiest and most cost effective first step would be get rid of Naloxone. Not everyone who is concerned with the drug problem is concerned about the addicts.

This is promoting murder as a solution to a medical problem........

You have an interesting concept of what constitute murder.

[Babba_not_Gump]

Oregon decriminalized drugs back in 2020.
How's it going for them?

This story glosses over the ugliness of Portland.
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory ... s-83846382
Mixed results for Oregon's pioneering drug decriminalization

This story does not gloss over the ugliness of Portland.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -rise.html
Distressing pictures of addicts passed out all over city show how its Democrat-backed drug decriminalization program has backfired spectacularly.
Homelessness and drug use continue to increase more than a year after Ballot Measure 110 passed.
Overdose deaths in the state hit an all-time high in 2021 with 1069, a 41 percent increase from 2020.

Portland is a lot worse than four years ago when I was there, for the last time ever.

Will Vancouver look like this in a couple of years?
Will our own communities look like a mini Portland?

Added: https://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/2022 ... cline.html

[the truth]

but ,but the know it all's on here said legal drugs in portugal was working great
more lies

[spooker]

but ,but the know it all's on here said legal drugs in portugal was working great
more lies

Portland was just mentioned ... not Portugal ... the following quote comes from skeptoid.com and really doesn't come across as "rah rah" or "bad idea" ...

The best way to characterize the first 20 years of the PDPM in summary is to note that it has had some major, though somewhat narrow, successes. Importantly, it hasn't failed anywhere; all of its outcomes have been either favorable or neutral at worst. Portugal's policy was implemented in a resource-starved test environment, among a population with a strong element that opposes it. It was done in a country that had a drug problem that was unusual due to Portugal's unique history, and may fare better if implemented in some other countries, and may fare worse in still others. It has suffered from international pushback, but has also inspired plenty of international imitation. The results, as defined by a number of metrics, are not as good as many of us might hope for; in others, they are. But that it's been able to produce results ranging from positive to neutral, with really nothing in the negative, says a lot for it; and that it produced these results under tough conditions says more. It is a model that will work best in countries with a strong interest in public health and data-driven policy, and will likely not work as well in countries that value religion-driven zero-tolerance policies above public health. In that sense, Portugal's drug program is not too far different from many other innovations.

https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4812

[my5cents]

but ,but the know it all's on here said legal drugs in portugal was working great
more lies

This entire topic of drug use and it's solution is skewed. In BC we are going to do what Portugal did, it worked there so it will work here.

Was/is the problem in Portugal the same one we are experiencing in Canada ?

Portugal decriminalized drug possession in 2001. They did so because of a problem with infections stemming from multi use of drug paraphernalia, mostly AIDS.

In 2009, Canada really started to have a drastic increase in problems with illicit drugs because of fentanyl overdoes and since then it has increased dramatically. This is 2022. In 2001 when Portugal initiated their program fentanyl wasn't a problem anywhere in the world.

So Portugal decriminalized drugs so users wouldn't get infected with diseases. The same illicit supply of drugs but with decriminalization of possession of the drugs and drug paraphernalia.

Canada has a problem with overdoses from the poorly concocted illicit drug supply.

Maybe someone can explain how a dangerous illicit drug supply problem is rectified by making that same dangerous supply legal (oh, sorry, decriminalized)

Oh, and by the way in Portugal they still seize drugs found on addicts and then their possession is review to see what type of treatment or sanction they should get. https://transformdrugs.org/blog/drug-de ... d-straight

Our proposed "solution" is to decriminalize the possession of small amounts of drugs with no seizing, no counseling just a pat on the head and off they go.

[Babba_not_Gump]

Read my post. It includes comments on Portugal.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory ... s-83846382

Will we end up like Portland or Portugal or ?.

And our teenagers.
They experiment with pretty well everything.
Next up, illicit drugs. Hey guys this is legal. Let's give it a shot.

[spooker]

Read my post. It includes comments on Portugal.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory ... s-83846382

Will we end up like Portland or Portugal or ?.

And our teenagers.
They experiment with pretty well everything.
Next up, illicit drugs. Hey guys this is legal. Let's give it a shot.

Two points ...

1) Portugal has had 20 years, initially things spiked as expected, then levelled out ... Oregon has had "a" year ...
2) They aren't "legalizing" drugs, they're just removing the criminal record if caught with a small amount of drugs ...

[Babba_not_Gump]

Read my post. It includes comments on Portugal.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory ... s-83846382

Will we end up like Portland or Portugal or ?.

And our teenagers.
They experiment with pretty well everything.
Next up, illicit drugs. Hey guys this is legal. Let's give it a shot.

Two points ...

1) Portugal has had 20 years, initially things spiked as expected, then levelled out ... Oregon has had "a" year ...
2) They aren't "legalizing" drugs, they're just removing the criminal record if caught with a small amount of drugs ...

Teens don't care about whether it's legal or decriminalized.
To them, it's another reason to try it, and some will die.

[spooker]

Two points ...

1) Portugal has had 20 years, initially things spiked as expected, then levelled out ... Oregon has had "a" year ...
2) They aren't "legalizing" drugs, they're just removing the criminal record if caught with a small amount of drugs ...

Teens don't care about whether it's legal or decriminalized.
To them, it's another reason to try it, and some will die.

Or one can look at the results:

"The most recent data on drug use among students were reported in the 2015 European School Survey Project on Alcohol and Other Drugs (ESPAD). Lifetime use of cannabis and other illicit substances among Portuguese students was slightly lower than the European average (based on data from 35 countries), with lifetime use of new psychoactive substances much lower than the average. Similarly, use of cigarettes in the last 30 days was just below the European average and alcohol use and binge drinking in the last 30 days were much lower than the average. Lifetime use of cannabis showed an increase in the 2003 survey, but it has remained relatively stable since, as indicated in the three subsequent surveys."

And overall deaths declined too ...

https://www.drugpolicyfacts.org/region/portugal

[Babba_not_Gump]

Teens don't care about whether it's legal or decriminalized.
To them, it's another reason to try it, and some will die.

Or one can look at the results:

"The most recent data on drug use among students were reported in the 2015 European School Survey Project on Alcohol and Other Drugs (ESPAD). Lifetime use of cannabis and other illicit substances among Portuguese students was slightly lower than the European average (based on data from 35 countries), with lifetime use of new psychoactive substances much lower than the average. Similarly, use of cigarettes in the last 30 days was just below the European average and alcohol use and binge drinking in the last 30 days were much lower than the average. Lifetime use of cannabis showed an increase in the 2003 survey, but it has remained relatively stable since, as indicated in the three subsequent surveys."

And overall deaths declined too ...

https://www.drugpolicyfacts.org/region/portugal

Ding, ding. We live in Canada, not Portugal.

If you have no concerns about BC teenagers experimenting with decriminalized drugs, fine, but I am fearful for our teens.

Maybe you had a sheltered teen years and was protected from life's vices, but the majority of teens aren't.

Teens will experiment with drugs. Decriminalize them, and they'll hit them harder then ever.

[the truth]

Or one can look at the results:



And overall deaths declined too ...

https://www.drugpolicyfacts.org/region/portugal

Ding, ding. We live in Canada, not Portugal.

If you have no concerns about BC teenagers experimenting with decriminalized drugs, fine, but I am fearful for our teens.

Maybe you had a sheltered teen years and was protected from life's vices, but the majority of teens aren't.

Teens will experiment with drugs. Decriminalize them, and they'll hit them harder then ever.

not all kids are intertested in trying drugs, i never was nor were my brothers and sisters nor my 3 kids, maybe parents need to be parents, and people saying kids will try drugs is just not true, thinking that way is part of the problem

[captkirkcanada]

but ,but the know it all's on here said legal drugs in portugal was working great
more lies

This entire topic of drug use and it's solution is skewed. In BC we are going to do what Portugal did, it worked there so it will work here.

Was/is the problem in Portugal the same one we are experiencing in Canada ?

Portugal decriminalized drug possession in 2001. They did so because of a problem with infections stemming from multi use of drug paraphernalia, mostly AIDS.

In 2009, Canada really started to have a drastic increase in problems with illicit drugs because of fentanyl overdoes and since then it has increased dramatically. This is 2022. In 2001 when Portugal initiated their program fentanyl wasn't a problem anywhere in the world.

So Portugal decriminalized drugs so users wouldn't get infected with diseases. The same illicit supply of drugs but with decriminalization of possession of the drugs and drug paraphernalia.

Canada has a problem with overdoses from the poorly concocted illicit drug supply.

Maybe someone can explain how a dangerous illicit drug supply problem is rectified by making that same dangerous supply legal (oh, sorry, decriminalized)

Oh, and by the way in Portugal they still seize drugs found on addicts and then their possession is review to see what type of treatment or sanction they should get. https://transformdrugs.org/blog/drug-de ... d-straight

Our proposed "solution" is to decriminalize the possession of small amounts of drugs with no seizing, no counseling just a pat on the head and off they go.

thats not the only reason portugal did what they did. they did it because the drug war is a failure and started treating it as a health issue , which would include getting diseases from iv drug use and sharing needles. instead of offering opinions as facts lets look at the real deal shall we ?

https://transformdrugs.org/blog/drug-de ... d-straight

In 2001, Portugal decriminalised the personal possession of all drugs as part of a wider
re-orientation of policy towards a health-led approach. Possessing drugs for personal use is instead treated as an administrative offence, meaning it is no longer punishable by imprisonment and does not result in a criminal record and associated stigma.1 Drugs are, however, still confiscated and possession may result in administrative penalties such as fines or community service.

Importantly, the decriminalisation of personal possession is only one part of broader health-centred drug policy reforms that involve an increased focus on harm reduction and treatment provision.6 By ‘accepting the reality of drug use rather than eternally hoping that it will disappear as a result of repressive legislation’, Portuguese reform allows drugs to be treated as a health, rather than criminal justice, issue.7 The benefits of these reforms, therefore, arise from both decriminalisation itself and the establishment of a wider health-based response to drug problems.

Portugal was not the first country to decriminalise some or all drugs, and it has not been the last.8 However, it is one of the most prominent and influential. The Portuguese model directly influenced the 2020 decriminalisation measure passed in Oregon, for example, as well as proposed decriminalisation in Norway.9 Portugal is regularly held up as the leading example of drug decriminalisation, so understanding the outcomes is vital.

In 2001, Portuguese drug death rates were very similar to the EU average. While rates fell in Portugal following reform, they increased across the rest of Europe in the same timeframe. From 2011 onwards both Portugal and the rest of the EU have trended similarly, rising until 2015/6 — however, the gap between the two remains considerably wider than it was pre-reform. In real terms, drug death rates in Portugal remain some of the lowest in the EU: 6 deaths per million among people aged 15-64, compared to the EU average of 23.7 per million (2019). They are practically incomparable to the 315 deaths per million aged 15-64 experienced in Scotland, which is over 50 times higher than the Portuguese rates.11

The move away from criminalising and imprisoning people who use drugs has led to a dramatic change in the profile of the prison population. In 2001, over 40% of the sentenced Portuguese prison population were held for drug offences, considerably above the European average, and 70% of reported crime was associated with drugs.13 While the European average has gradually risen over the past twenty years (from 14 to 18%), the proportion of people sentenced for drug offences in Portuguese prisons has fallen dramatically to 15.7% in 2019 — now below the European average.14

there is a lot more info on portugal , that is just a taste of what the facts are in the article .

[Catsumi]

Or one can look at the results:



And overall deaths declined too ...

https://www.drugpolicyfacts.org/region/portugal

Ding, ding. We live in Canada, not Portugal.

If you have no concerns about BC teenagers experimenting with decriminalized drugs, fine, but I am fearful for our teens.

Maybe you had a sheltered teen years and was protected from life's vices, but the majority of teens aren't.

Teens will experiment with drugs. Decriminalize them, and they'll hit them harder then ever.

I agree with you BB49 and Truth too.

The option of becoming a drug-addled, non-contributor to society wasn’t part of my upbringing either. No one said ‘gosh, when I am a grown-up I wanna be an addict’. Just off the charts, but today, it seems a viable choice. What with gov’t agencies mushrooming in employee numbers to cradle them, feed and house them, social workers falling all over themselves to ‘do good’, like they are baby birds that never have to reach adulthood, WE have made it totally an option for life choices.

This drug business is a business.

“Get them a shovel” Bill VanderZalm is needed today.

[spooker]

Or one can look at the results:



And overall deaths declined too ...

https://www.drugpolicyfacts.org/region/portugal

Ding, ding. We live in Canada, not Portugal.

If you have no concerns about BC teenagers experimenting with decriminalized drugs, fine, but I am fearful for our teens.

Maybe you had a sheltered teen years and was protected from life's vices, but the majority of teens aren't.

Teens will experiment with drugs. Decriminalize them, and they'll hit them harder then ever.

Growing up when I did meant that drugs were easy to get ... what saved me from trying anything more than pot was the discussions with my mom who fell into addiction ... having frank discussions about drugs helped me understand what they could affect, none of this "drugs are bad" shutting down the discussion ...