Sask. Bus Accident

Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby oldtrucker » Jan 12th, 2019, 2:14 am

the truth wrote:so, using your example then since you knew you should not of been driving is it murder ?


The example has a few 'hey look here' points.

-The hours of work on a continual basis.
-The short term and long term effects of fatigue on performance, short and long term health effects.
-Health effects of stress from a uncomprimising industry and employer.
-Loss of ones job regardless if not driving was the right choice. Ongoing toxic work environment.
-And as dirtybiker pointed out, the driver in Sask was green as grass. Training standards.

What trucking companies want from their employees is borderline criminal and endangers health and safety for all.
Hours of service and compensation needs to be changed to 8 hours/day, 44 hours per week, the elimination of by the mile and flat trip rate pay. By the hour only with overtime paid for work beyond those hours to financially discourage a trucking company over working a driver to exhaustion.

Answer : All aspects of the industry needs to be regulated to address the above points. Then the lines of what murder looks like in a situation like this bus accident would become less blurry.
The driver made huge, fatal mistakes but so did the people that allowed the industry to sink to where it is now. I wouldn't call the driver a murderer, he is another casualty.
Some may view my above politically incorrect opinions as 'harsh' and may even be offended by them. Some think political correctness will be our undoing.

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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby dogspoiler » Jan 13th, 2019, 2:49 pm

In BC Paramedics are allowed to work 16 hrs.
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby OKkayak » Jan 13th, 2019, 3:20 pm

the truth wrote:so, using your example then since you knew you should not of been driving is it murder ?

Point he’s trying to make is it would be legal. You’re pointing your finger at the wrong person.
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby tykrz » Jan 15th, 2019, 9:00 pm

Sure the drivers at fault but he’s the symptom not the disease.
The problem is with the trucking industry and Government. Operators hiring rookie drivers and cutting corners operationally.
Governments for lack of strict and tight regulations.
Unless things change it will happen again and it has. The city bus driver involved in the latest Ottawa accident involving fatalities was a rookie driver with a previous accident within the last year.
The trucking-bus industry really needs to become regulated by Transport Canada along with heavy handed enforcement where needed.
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby dirtybiker » Jan 16th, 2019, 12:29 pm

A good start,
MELT Programs (Mandatory Entry Level Training) rolling out in a few Provinces.
It will gain momentum and be Nation wide I suspect, before too long.


A couple write ups on the subject;
https://www.trucknews.com/keyword/melt/
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby oldtrucker » Jan 16th, 2019, 3:08 pm

tykrz wrote:The trucking-bus industry really needs to become regulated by Transport Canada along with heavy handed enforcement where needed.






The heavy handed stuff always seems to fall on the driver because that is the lowest hanging fruit.
Some may view my above politically incorrect opinions as 'harsh' and may even be offended by them. Some think political correctness will be our undoing.
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby dirtybiker » Jan 16th, 2019, 11:24 pm

An opinion piece by the Editorial Director of Today's Trucking.

Titled: Humboldt Legacy
Lessons will be learned in wake of fatal crash.
https://www.todaystrucking.com/humboldt ... ill-learn/


My input, Not until the lowly truck driver classification becomes a
"Red Seal Classification" as a "Skilled Trade" will true safety throughout
an Industry I hold dear, become that much better.


And I'm very near the final phase of my chosen career.
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby Gixxer » Jan 18th, 2019, 11:51 am

Driver fatigue is a huge hazard but nothing will ever change about it. I would say the OTR truckers are the most dangerous when it comes to driver fatigue. Their sleep cycle is constantly being disrupted. Sure they start the beginning of their work cycle well rested but it changes really quick and before you know it a driver is driving when he normally sleeps.
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby normaM » Jan 27th, 2019, 4:14 pm

The sentencing hearing begins tomorrow.
Hard for the families
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Maybe cheating not your thing

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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby sobrohusfat » Jan 27th, 2019, 4:23 pm

oldtrucker wrote:
tykrz wrote:The trucking-bus industry really needs to become regulated by Transport Canada along with heavy handed enforcement where needed.


The heavy handed stuff always seems to fall on the driver because that is the lowest hanging fruit.



i thought you heavy haulers were over-regulated to the nuts already from hours of opperation to inspections & checks.

Whats going to stop this from happening again? - i'm thinking not another rule & restriction.
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby RupertBear » Jan 27th, 2019, 5:37 pm

sobrohusfat wrote:
The heavy handed stuff always seems to fall on the driver because that is the lowest hanging fruit.




I think there should be a greater onus placed on the companies to ensure the drivers aren’t being placed in a position where they are endangering the public or potentially having to break the law, so the companies can make a few extra bucks. That includes proper trading for the drivers, ensuring the drivers are maintaining proper logs and making sure the trucks on the road are meeting all maintenance and roadworthiness requirements.Give the supervisor, company manager or owner the same sentence any driver gets and I bet we would see a lot of companies cleaning up their act.

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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby oldtrucker » Jan 27th, 2019, 6:15 pm

RupertBear wrote:Give the supervisor, company manager or owner the same sentence any driver gets and I bet we would see a lot of companies cleaning up their act.


Yup. :smt045
Some may view my above politically incorrect opinions as 'harsh' and may even be offended by them. Some think political correctness will be our undoing.

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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby the truth » Jan 27th, 2019, 9:34 pm

would be nice to see.
"The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it." -George Orwell
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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby OKkayak » Jan 27th, 2019, 11:25 pm

sobrohusfat wrote:

i thought you heavy haulers were over-regulated to the nuts already from hours of opperation to inspections & checks.

Whats going to stop this from happening again? - i'm thinking not another rule & restriction.

Compared to other countries, Canada is not even close.

Europe as an example, no more than 9 hours driving per day, Canada 13. Europe, no more than 4.5 hours of straight driving, Canada has no similar restrictions that I'm aware of.

As for inspections and checks, night and day.

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Re: Sask. Bus Accident

Postby dirtybiker » Jan 27th, 2019, 11:33 pm

Eta: A comparison to other Countries as compared to Canada is
apples to oranges.

Road networks, designs, and, ??? are an entirely different beast.

Initial Post:
A proper apprenticeship system, hand in hand with graduated licencing.
Hourly pay in the stead of piece work, as by the mile, or percentage of
load revenue is the norm.

Present system:
The more you move, the more you make, product, weight, mileage.
Any unforeseen downtime being on the driver.

Then, it leaves more decisions on movement to the driver.

Huge downside is when the lazy, or those with low ambition milk the
teat that feeds them.
Constantly parked, sporting the most imaginative excuse novel as to why
they simply cannot travel.

I should also mention a pay schedule of hourly would be pushed to the
price of product on the shelf.

I do apologize if this is deemed off topic, my thinking puts it smack
dab square on the topic.


I do hope everyone can find some peace, in time.
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