Minimum income for all

Minimum income for all

Postby dakoda62 » Dec 19th, 2018, 2:30 pm

*bleep*. more taxpayer dollars for permanent welfare, where are you getting the cash for this? Oh yeah the taxpayers. This moron has to go.

https://www.castanet.net/news/Canada/24 ... me-for-all
Last edited by ferri on Dec 19th, 2018, 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Link to article added.

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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby Omnitheo » Dec 19th, 2018, 2:50 pm

dakoda62 wrote:*bleep*. more taxpayer dollars for permanent welfare, where are you getting the cash for this? Oh yeah the taxpayers. This moron has to go.

https://www.castanet.net/news/Canada/24 ... me-for-all


The initial idea was actually born from conservatives as a way to get people off of welfare.

Those who will not work, are not going to work either way. Those who can though will not be satisfied with the bare minimum and will continue to work to earn a better living. Just like we do now.

As for where do we get the cash for this? From the economy. Those at the lower end of the income scale put a higher percentage of their money back into the economy than those at the top. Ensuring that canadians have the money they need to afford food, rent etc gets canadians off the streets. It gives a safety net to those who's jobs may be unstable. It gives canadians the opportunity to receive an education without going into a massive debt or having to choose between school for a career vs working a low wage job just to get by. It is money that will pass directly back into the economy. It also gives canadians the opportunity to take risks, new types of careers that they could otherwise not start because they are too busy with a minimum wage job scrambling for as much overtime as possible to pay the bills and thus unable to spend time investing in a new opportunity.

There are threads here complaining about the government not doing enough for canadians. Not helping get canadians off the street. Not helping laid off workers enough. Wearing yellow vests to protest low wages for canadians. Here is the government making an effort to solve all of those things.
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby Glacier » Dec 19th, 2018, 2:51 pm

IF they have a very low clawback rate such that you don't get penalized for working, it might work. If they start clawing back as soon as you start making minimum wage, they've just removed the incentive to work.
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby dakoda62 » Dec 19th, 2018, 3:43 pm

Do the math, in excess of 70 Billion.
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby Glacier » Dec 19th, 2018, 3:45 pm

dakoda62 wrote:Do the math, in excess of 70 Billion.

What are the current entitlements worth (including the cost of administering)?
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby jimmy4321 » Dec 19th, 2018, 3:47 pm

How do you come up with 70 billion?
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby the truth » Dec 19th, 2018, 4:03 pm

*removed*
Last edited by ferri on Dec 19th, 2018, 4:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Personal attack
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby dakoda62 » Dec 19th, 2018, 4:51 pm

jimmy4321 wrote:How do you come up with 70 billion?

Go to the and of the editorial.
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby oneh2obabe » Dec 19th, 2018, 5:00 pm

dakoda62 wrote:Do the math, in excess of 70 Billion.

Guaranteed basic income for all Canadians would cost $43 billion a year: PBO
“The total annual estimated gross cost of the defined GBI (guaranteed basic income) would range between $76 billion and $79.5 billion for the period 2018-2023,” the report notes.

https://globalnews.ca/news/4149318/guar ... on-a-year/
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby jimmy4321 » Dec 19th, 2018, 5:01 pm

yeah i did but you came across like you somehow did the math lol
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby dakoda62 » Dec 19th, 2018, 5:07 pm

Such a program would affect more than 7.5 million people, who would receive on average $9,421 a year, with the maximum amount reaching $16,989 for individuals and $24,027 for couples, before deductions for any income earned.
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby dakoda62 » Dec 19th, 2018, 5:09 pm

Here's a suggestion raise the basic exemption both federal and provincial

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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby Gilchy » Dec 19th, 2018, 6:15 pm

I’d like to see what UBI would look like as fully taxable income, with no claw backs, unlike OAS. This way, there is no disincentive to work, and the more you work or make, the more you take home net.

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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby Wheels » Dec 19th, 2018, 9:51 pm

Has been tried successfully in a region of India with excellent results. Allows people to look for jobs and assist in the community instead if foraging for food to survive.
Not sure Canada can afford it. Those in the middle class will always miss out because they are barely self sufficient. It won't affect the rich as they would be taxed the amount in return.
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Re: Minimum income for all

Postby hobbyguy » Dec 21st, 2018, 12:53 am

I note that they are not looking at a guaranteed minimum income for all. I remain unsold on on a guaranteed minimum income, however, when you think about it, the GIS is a guaranteed minimum income for seniors. That system seems to work fairly well, and not at a cost beyond reason.

Don't forget that folks at that end of the income scale spend every nickel, so it is a highly efficient way to bootstrap the economy. The mechanics is the important part. I can see extending a GIS type system to disabled folks for example. I can also see such a system being extended to families with a premium on earned income - i.e. if you work, you are guaranteed a living income - but that gets trickier.

"For all"? I can't see it. But I can see stepping stones, disabled, then veterans, then working families.

I could also see a bootstrap program, carefully designed, for a limited time period for those who are rehabilitating their lives, e.g. drug addicts who have gone clean. An incentive to get them habituated to working for a living. But that gets even trickier.

As far as a more open "for all" - I worry that it would act as a disincentive to folks working for living.
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