46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby floppi » Jan 25th, 2019, 12:30 pm

Omnitheo wrote:
countmeout wrote:
Yea, I hear ya. I'll brace for the 2:1 ratio and fear more taxes while I also prepare for automation to take over all the jobs [icon_lol2.gif]


Imagine if, and this might be a crazy idea, but we increase taxes on those who require a drastically smaller relative portion of their income for living expenses, and those who obtain that extra wealth via increased automation? Or at the very least we don’t go cutting those taxes thus leaving the burden on those who require a significantly higher proportion of their income go into their living expenses?


Imagine that, but I'm sure the CONServatives wouldn't like that very much as that would hurt their donation base.

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Postby Smurf » Jan 25th, 2019, 3:30 pm

Omnitheo wrote:

Imagine if, and this might be a crazy idea, but we increase taxes on those who require a drastically smaller relative portion of their income for living expenses, and those who obtain that extra wealth via increased automation? Or at the very least we don’t go cutting those taxes thus leaving the burden on those who require a significantly higher proportion of their income go into their living expenses?


A quick question. Will that tax include funds like CPP and other retirement funds that we all benefit from or just people that someone randomly feels make too much money.
Consider how hard it is to change yourself and you'll understand what little chance you have of changing others.

The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the most of everything that comes their way.

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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby Gone_Fishin » Jan 25th, 2019, 3:37 pm

Omnitheo wrote:Imagine if, and this might be a crazy idea, but we increase taxes on those who require a drastically smaller relative portion of their income for living expenses, and those who obtain that extra wealth via increased automation? Or at the very least we don’t go cutting those taxes thus leaving the burden on those who require a significantly higher proportion of their income go into their living expenses?


Who's going to judge how much money someone needs for their living expenses? Some jealous, left wing moron that is too damned lazy to better himself so that he has a few bucks in his pocket?
Ecclesiastes 10:2 "A wise man’s heart inclines him to the right, but a fool’s heart to the left."
Get a high school drama teacher to run a country, and what do you get? High school drama.

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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby JLives » Jan 25th, 2019, 3:51 pm

Gone_Fishin wrote:Who's going to judge how much money someone needs for their living expenses? Some jealous, left wing moron that is too damned lazy to better himself so that he has a few bucks in his pocket?


Pick me! Pick me!

I like AOC's idea. Anything over $10 million progressively taxed at 80%.

Jealous lol. NOBODY who's a multi-millionaire has worked and earned it. Zero percent. It's all been off the backs of others earning less so they could siphon more. I don't want to live in a society with extremely wealthy people. I want to live in a wealthy society where hard work actually earns a good living.
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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby Gone_Fishin » Jan 25th, 2019, 3:59 pm

JLives wrote:
Gone_Fishin wrote:Who's going to judge how much money someone needs for their living expenses? Some jealous, left wing moron that is too damned lazy to better himself so that he has a few bucks in his pocket?


Pick me! Pick me!



Okay, you fit the bill. To a tee. Couldn't think of anyone who suits the description more than you.
Ecclesiastes 10:2 "A wise man’s heart inclines him to the right, but a fool’s heart to the left."
Get a high school drama teacher to run a country, and what do you get? High school drama.

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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby burnedatstake » Jan 25th, 2019, 4:19 pm

goes to show what a scam the title "small business" is. its just a front for tax evasion purposes.
the capitalist idea of liberty is that one persons right to profit can be greater than another persons right to live.
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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby Queen K » Jan 25th, 2019, 4:41 pm

Gone_Fishin wrote:
Okay, you fit the bill. To a tee. Couldn't think of anyone who suits the description more than you.


GF, for Gawds sake, do you even know the people you talk to like this? :1422:
JLives works hard, has an accomplished career through sheer hard work and that is hardly achieve through laziness.

Before disparaging people you don't know, try thinking that a great many "leftists" actually have careers, houses and solid footing in their lives. Please manage to do that much, okay? :135:
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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby JLives » Jan 25th, 2019, 4:52 pm

QK stop! You're going to tarnish my reputation as a communist. :D
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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby hobbyguy » Jan 25th, 2019, 5:03 pm

G_F you do KNOW that federal governments have indeed put income limits on GIS and OAP for a donkey's years? That is who judges.

There are indeed many sides to the arguments about income inequality. But really what people are getting at is wealth inequality, and the differences between active and passive capital.

I have no problem with an entrepreneur who takes the risks, puts in the tremendous amount of work to start/build and maintain a company that provides income for many and who reinvests to build and grow that employment producing company. More power to them.

However, what we have seen develop in the last couple of decades is passive capital, mostly in the form of hedge funds, that sets out to destroy such active capital and transform it into hoarded passive capital - which becomes destructive of society. I have yet to see an effective way of reining in that destructive force of passive capital.

This is an interesting discussion that I feel misses the mark to some extent, because the author fails to make that distinction between active and passive capital: https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2014/05/08/thomas-pikettys-impoverished-debate-about-inequality-and-ours/#3c91e5973a97

"But the most important problem with talking only about income inequality is it focuses on relative income to the exclusion of absolute income. As Winston Churchill once put it, "The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings. The inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries." Is it really so great to live in a country where everyone is equally poor? Or is it better to live in a country with some income inequality, where those with low incomes have adequate food, shelter and opportunity?"

The fact that so many Canadians live so close to the edge of their means is unsettling, however one must remember that what is poor in Canada, is very, very wealthy in much of the world.
Anyone but Scheer - career pols are know nothings.

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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby Smurf » Jan 26th, 2019, 8:01 am

My problem is that in most of these so called true socialist countries are as bad if not worse (probably worse) than the capitalist countries. The ones at the top and their friends are extremely rich and the rest are poor. In capitalist countries everyone has a chance at becoming wealthy. To this day I feel I could have become a multimillionaire but it was me that did not want to take the steps to get there. I look around and see the numerous people that started with nothing and turned it into a fortune. I know a few and they are very good people that just took a couple of extra steps including if almost all cases risking everything they had, often a few times. Why should good people be penalized because they worked hard and got successful in life?

I knew a fellow in my first job as a banker who had a gravel truck in a small rural town. His truck broke down and he could not afford to repair it so he came to the bank for a loan. We could not give it to him because he had no collateral and banks could not use a person's only livelihood as security. A friend did the repairs and he paid him back later. He became the owner of one of the larger trucking companies in Canada and a multimillionaire through hard work and determination. He only had a high-school education. Why should he be penalized????????

I agree about passive capital to an extent. But is it not still out there in the world financing things and keeping the wheels turning from behind the scenes?

I believe we are listed as the third best country to live in. Is that a bad thing? How bad can capitalism be hurting us.
Consider how hard it is to change yourself and you'll understand what little chance you have of changing others.

The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the most of everything that comes their way.

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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby countmeout » Jan 26th, 2019, 8:53 am

JLives wrote:Pick me! Pick me!

I like AOC's idea. Anything over $10 million progressively taxed at 80%.

Jealous lol. NOBODY who's a multi-millionaire has worked and earned it. Zero percent. It's all been off the backs of others earning less so they could siphon more. I don't want to live in a society with extremely wealthy people. I want to live in a wealthy society where hard work actually earns a good living.

[icon_lol2.gif] [icon_lol2.gif] Your great plan is to sqwash those multimillionaires because thay didn't work for it?! Bahahahaha this is by far the stupidest thing I've read all year (we're only one month in so it ain't so bad ;) ).
So who supplies all the jobs? Walmarts? Since you don't like rich multimillionaires, what about the massive corps? Costco? The guy who owns Marios towing is rich by your standards, but look at all the jobs he creates? Wana push all these guys out with high taxes? Bye bye good jobs. What a load of *bleep* you spew.
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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby Catsumi » Jan 26th, 2019, 9:12 am

I count among my friends a few millionaires who came from modest homes who worked their arses off to better their lives. Most did not sleep more than 5-6 hours per nite, often rising at 4 a.m, to get to the businesses they created.

Over the years all paid staggering sums in personal, property, investment and business taxes. Now in their old age they get out and play which they held off doing when younger, preferring to pay down mortgages, business loans and educate their children. Unfortunately one just passed away before he could really reap the rewards from years of labour and yes, paying taxes.

The generosity of these folks is also amazing as I occasionally am privy to their volunteer hours, charities they donate to and support of the arts. Their kids behaviour was closely monitored during formative years and now they are pleasant, responsible and productive (you guessed it) tax payers.

To suggest a tax of 80% is silly. Why would anyone bother busting their backs to create businesses that you are employed by?
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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby jimmy4321 » Jan 26th, 2019, 10:00 am

It's a drag the idea of putting money away monthly isn't driven down the throats of young people more in the beginning of full time employment.
Doing so would mean you'd be laughing and living well or at least ok come retirement even if you never get out of that crappy job.
I'm 50 and playing catch up, much easier when younger and your body's fully cooperative Lol

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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby Smurf » Jan 26th, 2019, 11:06 am

I'll bet I saved half my retirement money by not having all the fancy electronics for most of my young life. I was quite old before I even paid for TV let alone computers and cell phones which cost a fortune. As I remember it we had just as good a life and entertainment, just different and probably a lot healthier on the average.
Consider how hard it is to change yourself and you'll understand what little chance you have of changing others.

The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the most of everything that comes their way.

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Re: 46% of Canadians on the brink of insolvency

Postby hobbyguy » Jan 26th, 2019, 12:13 pm

Smurf - I was looking at those country rankings. Canada is indeed 3rd overall but most importantly, Canada is ranked #1 in the world for Quality of Life. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/quality-of-life-rankings

"What social scientists do agree on is that material wealth is not the most important factor in assessing a life lived well. The results of the Quality of Life sub-ranking survey reflect that sensibility."

I suppose for some, material wealth is number one thing, but for me, the balance - the "quality of life" - is number one in the end. As an old fart, I can look back and know that some of the happiest times were both when I had no money and some were when I had money. A lot of the best times have little to do with money - like backpacking with friends (cost = very little).

I suppose that is the beauty of Canada, you can make of your life what you want in most places. We are ranked best in the world for personal freedom in another ranking system - and isn't that more important as well?
Anyone but Scheer - career pols are know nothings.

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