Alberta: more bad news coming

User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
Posts: 23965
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by fluffy »

Gone_Fishin wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 10:46 amOnly really, really stupid people that have no concept of reality want that.
Your opinion, such as it is, won't keep these people from voting.
Never miss a good chance to shut up.
User avatar
Alien Head Dude
Walks on Forum Water
Posts: 14574
Joined: Oct 18th, 2015, 9:19 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by Alien Head Dude »

fluffy wrote: You are forgetting that there is as considerable portion of the electorate that would just as soon seen see the oilsands gone, …
The writing is on the wall …
University of Calgary hits pause on bachelor's program in oil and gas engineering

For more than two decades, the bachelor's program in oil and gas engineering at the University of Calgary was popular with students seeking a career in energy — and maybe a job in one of the office towers downtown.

But after a long downturn in the oilpatch, enrolment at historic lows and the energy landscape changing, the university's engineering school is suspending admission of new students to the undergraduate program.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/ ... -1.6092648
The hard-right Cons on this board don't like anyone referencing the findings from the research
into conservative "thinking", but they sure do enjoy providing us with plenty of evidence for it.
ckil
Grand Pooh-bah
Posts: 2650
Joined: Nov 25th, 2018, 5:42 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by ckil »

fluffy wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 10:30 am
ckil wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 9:43 amOnce the Liberals are gone, Canada will experience a huge boom and the jobs will return.
You are forgetting that there is as considerable portion of the electorate that would just as soon seen see the oilsands gone, and while you and I both kn ow that's not going to happen any time soon those people still have a vote and as such deserve the PM's ear. Without him the TMX would still be bound up in court challenges and nervous investors.

Government does not set oil prices, nor do they control the market. O'Toole will no more be able to instigate a "huge boom" any more than Kenney could. Alberta is at the mercy of a global oversupply, and if the industry is no longer viable then that's their problem, propping them up with tax-payer dollars anything beyond what they have already received would be a bad idea on a number of levels.
You are aware that a large portion of the Liberal electorate is scared to go against Trudeau because of his hissy fits. He is a ruler, not a PM. He has openly admitted he likes China's communist rule.

I know very few who want the oilsands gone. The ones I do are so uneducated (brainwashed tree huggers) it is not funny. The TMX was walked away from because of Trudeaus stupid Bill C69 which adds so much cost and time to the project. Nothing else.

O'toole can abolish C69, which he will do. He will prove to be proactive and the foreign investment that fled overnight as soon as Trudeau was elected will return.

What oversupply are you talking about? Oil prices prove otherwise. Provide stats for all these subsidies to the energy sector you refer to. Compare those subsides to the personal and corporate income tax generated. Are you aware that other sectors get subsidized as well. Algoma just received almost $1b. Car manufacturers and consumers are receiving just as much for a product that will never take over the ICE.

Most of Canadas main pension funds are heavily invested in oil because it is very profitable and provides a stable cashflow. Are you willing to take a cut in your CPP if the Canada Pension Plan pulls out? I doubt it.

Your bitterness from losing your job in Alberta is clouding your judgement.

At the end of the day, profits dictate the debate and they are growing. They will continue to for decades, just like the last 80 year.
ckil
Grand Pooh-bah
Posts: 2650
Joined: Nov 25th, 2018, 5:42 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by ckil »

Ka-El wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:10 am
fluffy wrote: You are forgetting that there is as considerable portion of the electorate that would just as soon seen see the oilsands gone, …
The writing is on the wall …
University of Calgary hits pause on bachelor's program in oil and gas engineering

For more than two decades, the bachelor's program in oil and gas engineering at the University of Calgary was popular with students seeking a career in energy — and maybe a job in one of the office towers downtown.

But after a long downturn in the oilpatch, enrolment at historic lows and the energy landscape changing, the university's engineering school is suspending admission of new students to the undergraduate program.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/ ... -1.6092648
You mean the 40-student program? Big Deal! You do realize they will still have a mechanical and chemical engineering program that the oil industry will continue to hire from? Your argument is weak, just like a climate alarmist.
User avatar
crookedmember
Banned
Posts: 2872
Joined: Jan 8th, 2011, 9:43 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by crookedmember »

fluffy wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 10:30 am

You are forgetting that there is as considerable portion of the electorate that would just as soon seen see the oilsands gone, and while you and I both kn ow that's not going to happen any time soon those people still have a vote and as such deserve the PM's ear. Without him the TMX would still be bound up in court challenges and nervous investors.
It's dirty, it's expensive to extract. They literally have to dilute the stuff with gasoline to make it move down a pipe. Also, it sells at a usually large discount.

Unfortunately, 40-odd years of conservative misrule saw all of Alberta's conventional crude given away to the Americans. All that is left is thousands of orphan wells taxpayers will be forced to pay billions to clean up.

The old saw that conservatives are good at managing wealth is a sick myth.

And yes, Trudeau got a pipeline to tidewater built. Something Kenney couldn't accomplish during his two decades in Ottawa.

Who would have thought a bible school flunk-out slash lifetime politician like Jason would suck so bad?
All posts 100% moderator approved!
User avatar
Alien Head Dude
Walks on Forum Water
Posts: 14574
Joined: Oct 18th, 2015, 9:19 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by Alien Head Dude »

:135:
Last edited by Alien Head Dude on Jul 9th, 2021, 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The hard-right Cons on this board don't like anyone referencing the findings from the research
into conservative "thinking", but they sure do enjoy providing us with plenty of evidence for it.
User avatar
Alien Head Dude
Walks on Forum Water
Posts: 14574
Joined: Oct 18th, 2015, 9:19 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by Alien Head Dude »

ckil wrote: You mean the 40-student program? Big Deal! You do realize they will still have a mechanical and chemical engineering program that the oil industry will continue to hire from?
You do realize they mechanical and chemical engineering program graduates will be able to find employment outside of
the oil and gas sector. Good thing for them as we might not see the oil industry hiring a lot of people in the near future.
The hard-right Cons on this board don't like anyone referencing the findings from the research
into conservative "thinking", but they sure do enjoy providing us with plenty of evidence for it.
bob vernon
Lord of the Board
Posts: 3952
Joined: Oct 27th, 2008, 10:37 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by bob vernon »

And the Stampede is back! Alberta tall in the saddle again. Things returning to business as usual. Crowds at the parade and Stampede grounds, unmasked and cheering on their favourite chuckwagons and cowpokes. Watch the Covid cases rise.
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
Posts: 23965
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by fluffy »

ckil wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:20 amYou are aware that a large portion of the Liberal electorate is scared to go against Trudeau because of his hissy fits. He is a ruler, not a PM. He has openly admitted he likes China's communist rule.

I know very few who want the oilsands gone. The ones I do are so uneducated (brainwashed tree huggers) it is not funny. The TMX was walked away from because of Trudeaus stupid Bill C69 which adds so much cost and time to the project. Nothing else.

O'toole can abolish C69, which he will do. He will prove to be proactive and the foreign investment that fled overnight as soon as Trudeau was elected will return.

What oversupply are you talking about? Oil prices prove otherwise. Provide stats for all these subsidies to the energy sector you refer to. Compare those subsides to the personal and corporate income tax generated. Are you aware that other sectors get subsidized as well. Algoma just received almost $1b. Car manufacturers and consumers are receiving just as much for a product that will never take over the ICE.

Most of Canadas main pension funds are heavily invested in oil because it is very profitable and provides a stable cashflow. Are you willing to take a cut in your CPP if the Canada Pension Plan pulls out? I doubt it.

Your bitterness from losing your job in Alberta is clouding your judgement.

At the end of the day, profits dictate the debate and they are growing. They will continue to for decades, just like the last 80 year.
If I had a nickel for every time I had to listen to some uniformed, everythings-going-to-be-fine argument in support of the oilsands I could afford to send my CPP cheques back. The is a future for the oilsands, but it is short range. You might have actually been close to the mark to say thirty years, but by the time that rolls around the industry will look very little like it does now, just as the way it looks now bears little resemblance to the way it looked ten years ago. For the government, any government, to spend money on an industry in its sunset years is instant political suicide, especially when that industry has become morally debatable. How do you think Jason Kenney is going to do in the next election ? In a province that is crying for jobs he's handing out cheques to the producers as they run for the borders. Half of his own party wants him out the door for just the kind of crap you are proposing here, using taxpayer money to prop up an industry that is over the hump and on the way down.

PS: I left the oilsands by my own choice. I know that it's just going to get uglier and uglier up there as time goes on, and the producers squeeze harder and harder and the jobs get fewer and fewer, and I just don't want to be a part of that. I'm fortunate to have seen some of the gravy years up there and now it's time to kick back.
Never miss a good chance to shut up.
ckil
Grand Pooh-bah
Posts: 2650
Joined: Nov 25th, 2018, 5:42 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by ckil »

Ka-El wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:52 am
ckil wrote: You mean the 40-student program? Big Deal! You do realize they will still have a mechanical and chemical engineering program that the oil industry will continue to hire from?
You do realize they mechanical and chemical engineering program graduates will be able to find employment outside of
the oil and gas sector. Good thing for them as we might not see the oil industry hiring a lot of people in the near future.
You do realize that those graduates have always found employment in other industries? That is nothing new. Given the industry has realized its hardest blow in history because of Covid and is now rebounding, it is safe to say that hiring will increase.

Demand for oil is growing. That is a fact. If you prefer to have horrible countries and lower environmental laws to supply the demand rather than your neighbours, I feel sorry for you. What a disgrace Canadians have turned into.
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
Posts: 23965
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by fluffy »

bob vernon wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:54 am And the Stampede is back! Alberta tall in the saddle again. Things returning to business as usual. Crowds at the parade and Stampede grounds, unmasked and cheering on their favourite chuckwagons and cowpokes. Watch the Covid cases rise.
That will be interesting to watch. While Canada as a whole has passed the 40% mark for population fully vaccinated, Alberta hovers at just under 12%.
Never miss a good chance to shut up.
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
Posts: 23965
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by fluffy »

ckil wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:57 amDemand for oil is growing. That is a fact. If you prefer to have horrible countries and lower environmental laws to supply the demand rather than your neighbours, I feel sorry for you. What a disgrace Canadians have turned into.
Do you have a plan to turn that around? Business will always be business and the corporate sector cares little for anything but their own bottom line. Everybody sees the common sense in Canadians using their own product first, but apparently it's going to take a lot more than finger wagging to turn that into a reality.
Never miss a good chance to shut up.
ckil
Grand Pooh-bah
Posts: 2650
Joined: Nov 25th, 2018, 5:42 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by ckil »

crookedmember wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:25 am
fluffy wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 10:30 am

You are forgetting that there is as considerable portion of the electorate that would just as soon seen see the oilsands gone, and while you and I both kn ow that's not going to happen any time soon those people still have a vote and as such deserve the PM's ear. Without him the TMX would still be bound up in court challenges and nervous investors.
It's dirty, it's expensive to extract. They literally have to dilute the stuff with gasoline to make it move down a pipe. Also, it sells at a usually large discount.

Unfortunately, 40-odd years of conservative misrule saw all of Alberta's conventional crude given away to the Americans. All that is left is thousands of orphan wells taxpayers will be forced to pay billions to clean up.

The old saw that conservatives are good at managing wealth is a sick myth.

And yes, Trudeau got a pipeline to tidewater built. Something Kenney couldn't accomplish during his two decades in Ottawa.

Who would have thought a bible school flunk-out slash lifetime politician like Jason would suck so bad?
It is dirty when not refined. It is not expensive to scrape oil from sand. Removing the oil from the soil does the surrounding areas a favour and leaves it in a healthier state than before when the oil was in the sand. Does that make sense to you?

Suncors breakeven price is $35WTI. The Alberta bitumen is the best for asphalt, plastics and coking in metal manufacturing in the world.

All oil is diluted in shipping no matter if it is pipeline or rail. There is literally over a million miles of pipelines in NA built over decades. Your fascination with Kenney is funny.

How has the Liberals created wealth?

The oil is used to create everything you touch. Your life will crumble without it.

You sound like a typical tree hugger
ckil
Grand Pooh-bah
Posts: 2650
Joined: Nov 25th, 2018, 5:42 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by ckil »

fluffy wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:55 am
ckil wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:20 amYou are aware that a large portion of the Liberal electorate is scared to go against Trudeau because of his hissy fits. He is a ruler, not a PM. He has openly admitted he likes China's communist rule.

I know very few who want the oilsands gone. The ones I do are so uneducated (brainwashed tree huggers) it is not funny. The TMX was walked away from because of Trudeaus stupid Bill C69 which adds so much cost and time to the project. Nothing else.

O'toole can abolish C69, which he will do. He will prove to be proactive and the foreign investment that fled overnight as soon as Trudeau was elected will return.

What oversupply are you talking about? Oil prices prove otherwise. Provide stats for all these subsidies to the energy sector you refer to. Compare those subsides to the personal and corporate income tax generated. Are you aware that other sectors get subsidized as well. Algoma just received almost $1b. Car manufacturers and consumers are receiving just as much for a product that will never take over the ICE.

Most of Canadas main pension funds are heavily invested in oil because it is very profitable and provides a stable cashflow. Are you willing to take a cut in your CPP if the Canada Pension Plan pulls out? I doubt it.

Your bitterness from losing your job in Alberta is clouding your judgement.

At the end of the day, profits dictate the debate and they are growing. They will continue to for decades, just like the last 80 year.
If I had a nickel for every time I had to listen to some uniformed, everythings-going-to-be-fine argument in support of the oilsands I could afford to send my CPP cheques back. The is a future for the oilsands, but it is short range. You might have actually been close to the mark to say thirty years, but by the time that rolls around the industry will look very little like it does now, just as the way it looks now bears little resemblance to the way it looked ten years ago. For the government, any government, to spend money on an industry in its sunset years is instant political suicide, especially when that industry has become morally debatable. How do you think Jason Kenney is going to do in the next election ? In a province that is crying for jobs he's handing out cheques to the producers as they run for the borders. Half of his own party wants him out the door for just the kind of crap you are proposing here, using taxpayer money to prop up an industry that is over the hump and on the way down.

PS: I left the oilsands by my own choice. I know that it's just going to get uglier and uglier up there as time goes on, and the producers squeeze harder and harder and the jobs get fewer and fewer, and I just don't want to be a part of that. I'm fortunate to have seen some of the gravy years up there and now it's time to kick back.
This is what people like you do not understand. Oil will be with us until it runs out, at which time we lose our standard of living. EBVRYTHING we use is tied to oil. Even if we move away from gas cars the demand for oil will not go away. Everything you touch is oil and is cheap because of that. What occurs IF we move away from gas cars and that revenue deteriorates? The byproducts will still be in demand and the price of them will have to increase exponentially in order to keep the manufacturing and infrastructure profitable. Do you want to pay $20 for one Aspirin, $10,000 for a cheap computer, $120,000 for a cheap car, $200k for a Tesla 3, $90 per sq foot for siding, $100 for a gallon of paint, $50 for your lipstick? That is exactly what will occur if we move away from oil.

You have no basis for your side of the debate. Demand for oil is increasing and will do so unless we shrink the population.

PS. You left because you were not making $30 an hour in a low skilled job because the supply of labour pushed wages down. When Trudeau is gone investment will return and so will the jobs and higher wages. That is economics, not a move away from oil.

Oil is a necessity. Sorry you do not understand that.
ckil
Grand Pooh-bah
Posts: 2650
Joined: Nov 25th, 2018, 5:42 am

Re: Alberta: more bad news coming

Post by ckil »

fluffy wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 12:01 pm
ckil wrote: Jul 9th, 2021, 11:57 amDemand for oil is growing. That is a fact. If you prefer to have horrible countries and lower environmental laws to supply the demand rather than your neighbours, I feel sorry for you. What a disgrace Canadians have turned into.
Do you have a plan to turn that around? Business will always be business and the corporate sector cares little for anything but their own bottom line. Everybody sees the common sense in Canadians using their own product first, but apparently it's going to take a lot more than finger wagging to turn that into a reality.
Bottom line is what is responsible for advancements in technology, donations and job creation to name a few. Business put profit first because without it they would not exist. Corps are the largest investors in R&D, donations and job creation. You should welcome the principal.

Return to “Canada”