Gun Control

[36Drew]

That's a lot of words for stamping your feet and proclaiming that you're right dammit and anyone who isn't convinced by your argument is dumb. It's typical of people who are on the losing side of an argument to dismiss their opposition with name-calling and claiming that they're incapable of understanding, when really they just disagree with you.

And your next paragraph is a whole lot of useless diatribe that really only shows you have no clue at all what you're talking about.

I understand the issue.

You don't seem to understand the issue in the least.

I grew up with guns in the house. I took a gun handling course in a public school when I was 13. I get that shooting is fun, hunting is fun and productive.

Good for you. I am sure that you also have had driver's education, first aid, perhaps a rope-tying course and maybe even a knife-safety course. The scouts have badges for those. You earned one - good job, kid.

I totally reject the idea that anyone in Canada needs a gun for self defence (and truly, our laws have always reflected that), and furthermore think that's a dangerous path to go down.

There is not a word in that sentence that I disagree with, and I doubt anyone in this thread or forum will disagree with. Guns are not for self defence. They are tools for hunting and sport.

I don't think banning all guns is necessary, nor do I think doing so would eliminate gun crime, but I think that some firearms lift right out and plenty of other alternatives are available.

I don't think anyone needs an 840+ horsepower vehicle that is capable of launching from 0-100kph in 2.3 seconds for anything other than racing. But hey - some people absolutely love driving around in their Challenger Hellcats. Who the hell are you and I to tell them what they can and can't own/operate so long as they're licensed, insured, and follow the law?

Let's unpack what you've just said.

I don't think banning all guns ...would eliminate gun crime

So you can agree that gun crime is not directly correlated to or caused by gun ownership.

but I think that some firearms lift right out and plenty of other alternatives are available.

...but you want to ban guns that you, personally, have a distaste for and feel others shouldn't be allowed to own them.

The go-to argument that the criminals who really want guns will always be able to access them has a grain of truth

It has far more than a grain of truth. While stats-can is on record stating that the police do not report the origin of all guns used in all gun crime, but they do know that all the handguns that gangs use are either stolen or imported. Theres zero ability to trace those origins at the moment.

https://sencanada.ca/content/sen/commit ... _ppt_e.pdf
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-sco ... -1.5579971

but the thing that the pro-gun crowd can never overcome is the simple, common sense fact that fewer guns = less gun violence.

Prove it. Go find some facts to back up your - as yet - unsubstantiated argument.

rigorous gun acquisition requirements

How much more rigorous do you want our gun acquisition requirements to be in Canada? How are they not rigorous enough? What holes exist in them that seem to be a challenge for you?

mean fewer accidental shootings, handling accidents and fewer irresponsible people who have no business owning guns, owning guns.

How many handling accidents per year do we have? How many licensees do we have in Canada that should have their PAL/RPAL revoked and their firearms seized? Provide some examples.

Ironically, one of the things that works against the pro-gun lobby in this country, imo, is the success of the gun industry in the USA and the frightening example of what unfettered gun ownership looks like.

There is not a licensed firearm owner in this country that will be calling for looser licensing laws. Every single person I've encountered who has a PAL or RPAL fully understands our licensing regime, accepts it, and supports it as an example of how well licensees are monitored and how easy it is for a license to be revoked from someone who shouldn't have one.

That many of the crime-related guns come to this country from the states only reinforces the argument that their gun policies are an extreme example of messed-up and we're best not to move in that direction at all. That guns are illegally imported isn't a gun control issue, it's a border control issue.

....and here's the cognitive dissonance.

"many of the crime-related guns come to this country from the states"
"That guns are illegally imported isn't a gun control issue, it's a border control issue"

See my previous post that you got so offended over.


To take a bow to Bill Maher: New Rule. Before we enact more useless legislation that only further frustrates and potentially criminalizes otherwise law-abiding citizens - without actually stopping criminals - the government/RCMP/CBP/courts stop being so damned lazy and actually do the job they've hired to do and enforce the laws they already have.

[Gone_Fishin]

I think that some firearms lift right out and plenty of other alternatives are available.

Okay, let's assume you're in control of banning firearms that you think shouldn't be allowed in Canada.

Which of these two would you ban, and why?

[Nedroj]

I think that some firearms lift right out and plenty of other alternatives are available.

Okay, let's assume you're in control of banning firearms that you think shouldn't be allowed in Canada.

Which of these two would you ban, and why?

Id also like to ask if he would ban this rifle or not.



Because under JT's new laws, this classic hunting rifle went from being non-restricted (ie can be used for hunting) to being outright banned as in it is now not even allowed to be used at a licensed gun range for sport shooting.

[GordonH]

I think that some firearms lift right out and plenty of other alternatives are available.

Okay, let's assume you're in control of banning firearms that you think shouldn't be allowed in Canada.

Which of these two would you ban, and why?

#1) looks more of traditional hunting rifle/hunter of wild game.
#2) looks more like a want to be soldier/hunter of humans.

[Catri]

Let's throw a little logic in here for a moment. The leading cause of death in Canada is impaired driving. Problem solved if we take away everyone's car.

That's not logic, that's whataboutism. It's also wrong, impaired driving is not the leading cause, or even a leading cause of death in Canada...not even close. When you just make stuff up like that it doesn't add credibility to your argument.

[Catri]

I think that some firearms lift right out and plenty of other alternatives are available.

Okay, let's assume you're in control of banning firearms that you think shouldn't be allowed in Canada.

Which of these two would you ban, and why?

Nope, that's not my job. I'm just trying to explain what you're up against and why you aren't going to convince people who are absolutely fine with stricter gun controls that you're being put upon by gun control measures. The onus is on you to explain the need for ordinary Canadians to own the guns that are being banned, without reverting to the whole "but criminals will get them anyway" argument, because it's just not very convincing. I also don't have to quantify the "fewer guns = less gun violence" thing, because agree with it or not, it does resonate with common sense.

[Gone_Fishin]

Okay, let's assume you're in control of banning firearms that you think shouldn't be allowed in Canada.

Which of these two would you ban, and why?

#1) looks more of traditional hunting rifle/hunter of wild game.
#2) looks more like a want to be soldier/hunter of humans.

At least you tried, Gordy, whereas the Liberal pumperpoodle showed her complete lack of understanding of firearms but she feels very qualified to tell us what we should do with them.

These are exactly the same firearm, a Ruger 10/22, commonly used for hunting grouse and rabbits.

Liberals get so scared they wet their pants when they see the bottom one.

[Sparki55]

The onus is on you to explain the need for ordinary Canadians to own the guns that are being banned, without reverting to the whole "but criminals will get them anyway" argument, because it's just not very convincing. I also don't have to quantify the "fewer guns = less gun violence" thing, because agree with it or not, it does resonate with common sense.

So if the government bans sports cars is the onus on the public to explain why the public should be allowed them or the government to explain why they are banning it?

Common sense isn't a thing lol. Common sense is subjective by so many variables lol.

85% of guns used in crime I'm Canada are smuggled into the country.

That's like banning cars because sometimes they are stolen and used in bank robberies.

Anyway, not worth my time, the government has already figured out how to politicize gun control to gain votes. The propaganda machine won't turn off now. I hope there are wealthy gun owners with the money to fight this nonsense.

[36Drew]

Tangentially-related - I wonder how the anti-firearms-that-look-scary crowd feels about knife ownership? There's a lot more knives involved in crime/assault/murder than there are firearms in Canada.

Should the average Canadian be allowed to own one of these? It's a knife that seems to have no practical use other than the very-specific purpose that it was designed for (combat). http://www.beshknives.com/models.php

[Gone_Fishin]

That's a black knife, too, making it even more scary than if it were pink or blue.

Just like that black rifle is so scary compared to the same one in a brown wooden stock.

[puterbrother]

Gun control is here to stay in Canada, and more control is coming due to its overwhelming popularity and effectiveness. Few Canadians want to move towards the horrendous dumpster fire of school shootings and gun-assisted domestic violence plaguing our neighbour to the south.

More access to guns is a losing issue for any political party in Canada, as Mr. O'Toole found as he flip-flopped his way through the last campaign trying to appease the gun nuts, while not horrifying the vast majority.

Res ipsa loquitur.

Well...as far as what you call a "dumpster fire" down south,they are a different culture from us,so that's not going to happen.
Seeing as how you are so good with finding graphs of gun violence deaths around the world,try looking up deaths by other means around the world and watch,to your horror as the graph looks a lot different.The tool may change but the result is the same.This may be hard for you to understand given your political view,but your Government is not your friend and IT will try to make you dependent on them at all cost.To do that they need us defenseless.I would LOVE to stand back and watch you flop around like a fish out of water when that happens but then it would be happening to me too.If you insist on trying to take my freedoms and you succeed,all I can say is, sit back and enjoy the show but I'm warning you you are not going to like the price of admission !

[seewood]

3-monkeys.jpg

[36Drew]

That's a black knife, too, making it even more scary than if it were pink or blue.

Just like that black rifle is so scary compared to the same one in a brown wooden stock.

Hrmm - well the handle on mine looks like I could easily remove it to spray it blue. Maybe even red. Might reduce the effectiveness on the handle grip surface, though.

[Gone_Fishin]

That's a black knife, too, making it even more scary than if it were pink or blue.

Just like that black rifle is so scary compared to the same one in a brown wooden stock.

Hrmm - well the handle on mine looks like I could easily remove it to spray it blue. Maybe even red. Might reduce the effectiveness on the handle grip surface, though.

You know, I think Liberals are racist against blacks. Black Archangel stocks, black Boyds stock, black Tapco stocks.

Good thing I chose the orange handled Outdoor Edge for skinning my deer - the black handled one scares Liberals and will probably be banned.

[GordonH]

^^^ Somewhere around my home is a Damascus steel pocket knife I’ve had since the farm.