Gun Control

seewood
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Re: Gun Control

Post by seewood »

Sparki55 wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 5:17 pm "Military-style" is quoted because prior to the Trudeau Liberals scaring people about guns, Canadians were not allowed to own military-type firearms. Guns that were used in war are not allowed to be sold in Canada to persons with a firearm license.
Sparki, not quite right but I get the idea. I can still legally purchase a M1 Garand in either 3006 or .308, 8 round stripper clip, Lee-Enfield, 10 round magazine, german and Russian bolt action that were used in WW2, or 1 for that matter with a PAL.

The fully automatic capable ASSAULT rifles used by todays military are prohibited in Canada and have been since the 70's I believe.
Andrewski wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 4:58 pm Oh boy I sure do love killing things, that's why I got me a gun... so I can kill things super duper quick. It doesn't have any other purpose other than to kill things as quickly as possible, but I think everyone and their children should own and shoot guns regularly to prevent things from dying. All those guns I have will surely prevent things from getting killed.
Are you OK?

For the record, I used to hunt, deer Moose and Elk ( no luck there though) 40 years ago. I loved traipsing about the sub alpine areas in this province. Filled the freezer for a number of years and didn't purchase much if any beef.
Son is now going to take over the 06 and I'm just going to punch holes in paper. I find it calming and relaxing, perhaps my knitting.
Yes, guns do have another purpose other than" kill things super duper quick" Sometimes they are used to shoot little clay disks zinging across the sky, with varying degrees of success.
As I've mentioned before in this thread, the gun haters will hate and despise things that go bang and the legal, law following gun owners like things that go bang. Not likely going to change any minds any time soon.
I am not wealthy but I am rich
Sparki55
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Sparki55 »

foenix wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 6:42 pm That's a bold claim. I'm absolutely sure that's not true if one counts USA but even Canada that's hard to believe. Got anything to back up the hyperbole?
There are approximately 1,200 (I'm overestimating) gun crimes reported per year in Canada. About 4 million Canadians own guns. Including all gun crime accounts for 0.03% if all 100% of crime was committed by legal owners. So it would take a mountain to change my mind in that.

Have anything the other way? Did I mess up on total # of crimes?
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Babba_not_Gump
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Babba_not_Gump »

Andrewski wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 5:25 pm ....and criminals will always have guns.
Now this makes sense. What do you suggest be done about it?
Ensuring every citizen has guns doesn't prevent crime.
No one is stating that EVERY citizen should have a gun.
It just means everyone is now shooting each other.
No, EVERYONE is not shooting each other. Not in Canada, not in America, not even in Ukraine.
I'm posting this from Traditional lands of the British Empire & the current Lands of The Dominion of Canada.
I also give thanks for this ethos richness bestowed on us via British Colonialism.

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Babba_not_Gump
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Babba_not_Gump »

VaxisSafe wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 6:21 pm
The Green Barbarian wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 6:09 pm

There is no bigger environmentalist/lover of animals then a hunter.
How can someone who kills animals with a gun be an animal lover?
Ever heard of Ducks Unlimited?
I'm posting this from Traditional lands of the British Empire & the current Lands of The Dominion of Canada.
I also give thanks for this ethos richness bestowed on us via British Colonialism.

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VaxisSafe
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Re: Gun Control

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bb49 wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 9:38 pm
VaxisSafe wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 6:21 pm

How can someone who kills animals with a gun be an animal lover?
Ever heard of Ducks Unlimited?
Uh..yes I have. Are you suggesting the majority of contributors are hunters who use guns to shoot animals? Is there info avails or o how many contributors own guns or something?
foenix
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Re: Gun Control

Post by foenix »

Sparki55 wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 7:53 pm
foenix wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 6:42 pm That's a bold claim. I'm absolutely sure that's not true if one counts USA but even Canada that's hard to believe. Got anything to back up the hyperbole?
There are approximately 1,200 (I'm overestimating) gun crimes reported per year in Canada. About 4 million Canadians own guns. Including all gun crime accounts for 0.03% if all 100% of crime was committed by legal owners. So it would take a mountain to change my mind in that.

Have anything the other way? Did I mess up on total # of crimes?
So just a personal opinion and a guess then?......Got it! :up:

Here's what you said tho'......
Over 99.9% of current and past licenced gun owners have never committed a crime, nevermind an actual gun crime.
See the difference?
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Sparki55 »

foenix wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 7:02 am So just a personal opinion and a guess then?......Got it! :up:
I explained the data I used to come to my opinion. If you'd like to point fun at where I went wrong with the data or whatnot go for it. Trying to get a rise out of me when I clearly didn't use emotion to come to a decision (the act I was calling out earlier that you are referencing) is a little sad lol.
foenix wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 7:02 am Here's what you said tho'......
Over 99.9% of current and past licenced gun owners have never committed a crime, nevermind an actual gun crime.
See the difference?
Yes, and I'll stand behind that statement. I had the number of violent crimes with a firearm per year wrong, it's closer to 6,500 per year in Canada.

This means that if the total of 6,500 crimes per year were carried out only by those with gun licenses, then 0.16% of the gun-owning population would have committed a crime. That's an insanely exaggerated number, just showing off my confidence with my bold statement of 99.9%. We know that almost all of the guns used in crime in Canada are smuggled from the US, most are highly prohibited in Canada. Knowing that most of the guns used in crime are smuggled we then can infer that legal gun owners are not committing the bulk of the gun crimes, why get a license when you plan to smuggle guns?

You are also not allowed to own a gun if you have a criminal record in Canada. So all current gun owners 100% do not have a crime associated with them.

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/pub/ ... t=Ba0aeASG
foenix
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Re: Gun Control

Post by foenix »

Sparki55 wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 8:41 am
foenix wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 7:02 am So just a personal opinion and a guess then?......Got it! :up:
I explained the data I used to come to my opinion. If you'd like to point fun at where I went wrong with the data or whatnot go for it. Trying to get a rise out of me when I clearly didn't use emotion to come to a decision (the act I was calling out earlier that you are referencing) is a little sad lol.
foenix wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 7:02 am Here's what you said tho'......



See the difference?
Yes, and I'll stand behind that statement. I had the number of violent crimes with a firearm per year wrong, it's closer to 6,500 per year in Canada.

This means that if the total of 6,500 crimes per year were carried out only by those with gun licenses, then 0.16% of the gun-owning population would have committed a crime. That's an insanely exaggerated number, just showing off my confidence with my bold statement of 99.9%. We know that almost all of the guns used in crime in Canada are smuggled from the US, most are highly prohibited in Canada. Knowing that most of the guns used in crime are smuggled we then can infer that legal gun owners are not committing the bulk of the gun crimes, why get a license when you plan to smuggle guns?

You are also not allowed to own a gun if you have a criminal record in Canada. So all current gun owners 100% do not have a crime associated with them.

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/pub/ ... t=Ba0aeASG
Spin it all you want, it's still a wild guess......and btw, I'm think the difference wasn't seen..... the quote was.......
Over 99.9% of current and past licenced gun owners have never committed a crime, nevermind an actual gun crime.
.....so now instead of any "crime", it's "violent crime with a firearm".....so what's next"....."violent crimes with firearm that occur on tuesdays and thursdays"?
Sparki55
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Sparki55 »

foenix wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 8:49 am Spin it all you want, it's still a wild guess......and btw, I'm think the difference wasn't seen..... the quote was.......
It's not a spin, it's a fact to have a firearm license you cannot have a criminal record. It's also a fact that most firearms used in crimes in Canada are smuggled and prohibited from ownership.
foenix wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 8:49 am
Over 99.9% of current and past licenced gun owners have never committed a crime, nevermind an actual gun crime.
.....so now instead of any "crime", it's "violent crime with a firearm".....so what's next"....."violent crimes with firearm that occur on tuesdays and thursdays"?
Current gun owners yes, they have never committed a crime that is still on their record, or else their license would be revoked, checked every night by the RCMP BTW. Past gun owners, well it's safe to say they didn't commit any crimes they were caught for while they had a license.

Anyway, I've posted some numbers and shown the reasoning I use to form my opinion. The best you have done is just said you don't agree lol. Before you make some more unsupported claims, why don't you come back with some numbers showing that only 99.8% of current and past licensed gun owners have never committed a crime.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by foenix »

Sparki55 wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 8:57 am
foenix wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 8:49 am Spin it all you want, it's still a wild guess......and btw, I'm think the difference wasn't seen..... the quote was.......
It's not a spin, it's a fact to have a firearm license you cannot have a criminal record. It's also a fact that most firearms used in crimes in Canada are smuggled and prohibited from ownership.
Total spin, one can commit a crime and not have a record either......and we're talking "any crime" here not just firearm crimes in Canada.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by foenix »

Sparki55 wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 8:57 am
Anyway, I've posted some numbers and shown the reasoning I use to form my opinion. The best you have done is just said you don't agree lol. Before you make some more unsupported claims, why don't you come back with some numbers showing that only 99.8% of current and past licensed gun owners have never committed a crime.
I'm not the one making the laughable claim. The onus is on the one that's making the ridiculous claim to produce the evidence otherwise it's just an opinion and a guess.
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The Green Barbarian
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Re: Gun Control

Post by The Green Barbarian »

VaxisSafe wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 6:21 pm

How can someone who kills animals with a gun be an animal lover?
This is as dumb a comment as saying how can a farmer who grows vegetables be a lover of vegetables.
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Babba_not_Gump
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Babba_not_Gump »

VaxisSafe wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 10:05 pm
bb49 wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 9:38 pm
Ever heard of Ducks Unlimited?
Uh..yes I have. Are you suggesting the majority of contributors are hunters who use guns to shoot animals? Is there info avails or o how many contributors own guns or something?
I dunno. Why don't you find out, let us know.
I'm posting this from Traditional lands of the British Empire & the current Lands of The Dominion of Canada.
I also give thanks for this ethos richness bestowed on us via British Colonialism.

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VaxisSafe
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Re: Gun Control

Post by VaxisSafe »

bb49 wrote: May 3rd, 2022, 12:14 pm
VaxisSafe wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 10:05 pm

Uh..yes I have. Are you suggesting the majority of contributors are hunters who use guns to shoot animals? Is there info avails or o how many contributors own guns or something?
I dunno. Why don't you find out, let us know.
Me and family members have donated previously and we don't own guns nor do we hunt

An explanation would be appreciated re: how this wetland charity has anything to do with gun control.
mikest2
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Re: Gun Control

Post by mikest2 »

VaxisSafe wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 10:05 pm
bb49 wrote: May 2nd, 2022, 9:38 pm
Ever heard of Ducks Unlimited?
Uh..yes I have. Are you suggesting the majority of contributors are hunters who use guns to shoot animals? Is there info avails or o how many contributors own guns or something?
You might give this a read, and then check out the work carried out by every fish and game club in Canada. We are not basement dwellers

https://www.ducks.ca/about/
Once I thought I was wrong.....but I was mistaken...

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