Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Do you feel politically homeless?

Yes
23
62%
No
7
19%
Sometimes
7
19%
 
Total votes: 37

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Merry
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Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by Merry »

A recent poll indicated that many Canadans now feel that the various political parties are too polarized to suit their more centrist taste.
Wright asked respondents who said they felt homeless to name two things in each party that made them feel that way. For the Liberals, it was the leader and economic/tax policies; for the Conservatives, it was the leader and the party’s social policies; for the NDP, it was economic/tax policies and social policies (notably, not the leader); for the Greens, it was the party’s ideological stance and economic/tax policies.
https://nationalpost.com/opinion/john-i ... n_with_ads

As someone who has, over the years, voted for each one of the top three Parties, I share the apparent mainstream view that none of the mainstream political Parties currently represent the “middle of the road” voter. They’ve all been hijacked by partisan extremists.

How many of you feel the same way?
Last edited by Merry on Mar 24th, 2021, 9:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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lifegives
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by lifegives »

I definitely do. Screw the party, vote the person. (I wish it was that simple)
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Hurtlander
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by Hurtlander »

I’m sure that Canada has a rather large number of fiscally and socially responsible centrists formally referred to as “red Tory’s” or “blue Liberals” that simply don’t know where to park their next vote.... Personally I feel that the Trudeau Liberals are too far left for these people, but many held their noses and voted Liberal last election because they found Scheer, rightly or wrongly, to be representing the far right. The next election might very well have a different outcome now that O’Toole leads the CPC, though the outcome of the recent CPC convention indicates that O’Toole doesn’t appeal to a certain segment of the CPC, O’Toole certainly has drawn the favourable attention of many “red Torey’s” and “blue Liberals”. Now the question is, will the Liberals continue to keep moving to the left with their upcoming budget, or will the next Liberal budget show signs of fiscal responsibility that will appeal to those that want both fiscally and socially responsible government.
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Queen K
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by Queen K »

Maybe set that up as a poll here in this thread Merry? I know which box I would check off. :up:
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typhoon44
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by typhoon44 »

100% homeless.
Give me a party that believes in the following (in no particular order).
advancing human rights in Canada and worldwide
lives within our means - reduce the size of government, eliminate defined benefit pension plans
understands that protecting the environment doesn't have to mean blowing up our economy - oil and coal are not on the path to the future
improve the economy by supporting technological advancement using education starting at early ages through to trades and advanced degrees but also including support for innovation in business
wealth inequality is a major problem - we need to grow the middle class and reign in executive compensation
opportunity inequality is a major problem - fix the imbalance with women compensation in the workplace first. This is also our quickest path to improving the economy. Sponsored childcare will go a long way. Paying families to have more children does not.
protect and market Canada's best natural resource - increase parks and protected lands supporting tourism
solve indigenous rights. This can has been kicked down the road for too long and it is bad for the country - care about fixing it.
Charitable organizations must show value to society beyond making money to keep them afloat. Money spent on anti-abortion, Covid-denying, anti-masking, and other conspiracy theories must not be tax-deductible. Enforce this strictly - set the rules, one offence and they lose their charitable status.
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Merry
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by Merry »

Queen K wrote:Maybe set that up as a poll here in this thread Merry? I know which box I would check off. :up:
Send me a pm telling me how to do it, and I will
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The Green Barbarian
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by The Green Barbarian »

Queen K wrote:Maybe set that up as a poll here in this thread Merry? I know which box I would check off. :up:
Me too! Anything but Liberal or NDP! :up:
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by The Green Barbarian »

Merry wrote:
Queen K wrote:Maybe set that up as a poll here in this thread Merry? I know which box I would check off. :up:
Send me a pm telling me how to do it, and I will
Just go to your OP, and hit edit. Then look at the bottom and you should see a tab that says "Poll creation". Even I figured it out so it can't be that hard! :D
Justin Trudeau- racist, elitist, liar. What a sick piece of garbage.

"Mr. Trudeau, you are a disgrace to any democracy. Please spare us your presence" - European Union addressing the sad sack of **** that is currently our PM.
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Merry
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by Merry »

typhoon44 wrote:100% homeless.
Give me a party that believes in the following (in no particular order).
advancing human rights in Canada and worldwide
lives within our means - reduce the size of government, eliminate defined benefit pension plans
understands that protecting the environment doesn't have to mean blowing up our economy - oil and coal are not on the path to the future
improve the economy by supporting technological advancement using education starting at early ages through to trades and advanced degrees but also including support for innovation in business
wealth inequality is a major problem - we need to grow the middle class and reign in executive compensation
opportunity inequality is a major problem - fix the imbalance with women compensation in the workplace first. This is also our quickest path to improving the economy. Sponsored childcare will go a long way. Paying families to have more children does not.
protect and market Canada's best natural resource - increase parks and protected lands supporting tourism
solve indigenous rights. This can has been kicked down the road for too long and it is bad for the country - care about fixing it.
Charitable organizations must show value to society beyond making money to keep them afloat. Money spent on anti-abortion, Covid-denying, anti-masking, and other conspiracy theories must not be tax-deductible. Enforce this strictly - set the rules, one offence and they lose their charitable status.
Although I don’t agree with everything on your wish list, I do agree with a fair chunk of it. So, instead of focusing on the things I disagree with, I’m going to take the much rarer step of focusing on the things we do agree on.

Living within our means - although we may have a different opinion as to how best to achieve that goal, I do agree that Governments need to limit their spending to what taxpayers can afford to pay for.
Protecting our environment without destroying our economy. Canada needs a long term plan that is developed with the combined effort of both scientists and economists, instead of politicians and activists.
Investing in research and technology.
Promoting trades and technology in our schools.
Grow the middle class, and find a way to rein in executive compensation. But that might be harder to achieve than it sounds. For example, I believe that was the intention when they tried to increase the tax on stock options, which is how most top executives are compensated, yet the ensuing outcry forced the Government to back-peddle. So I’m not sure what can be done to make sure these over paid executives pay their fair share of taxes.
Accessible, affordable daycare ought to be a no brainer for EVERY Party. With so many workers retiring, Canada needs as many women as possible in the workforce. But that’s never going to happen without access to affordable daycare.
Invest Government funds in ways that will promote international tourism in Canada.
Review which organizations ought to have charitable status, and which should not. I share your concern that the definition of “charity” has been broadened to include groups of people who hold particular world views, as opposed to groups that work to help vulnerable people who need assistance. The former should still be allowed to fund raise, but not to have any kind of tax exempt status.
The indigenous rights issue is the most difficult issue to solve, because even the indigenous people themselves don’t all agree on the solution. However, I think a good place to start would be to repeal the Indian Act and start from scratch.
"In a world swathed in political correctness, the voting booth remains the final sanctuary where the people are free to speak" - Clifford Orwin
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by rustled »

Merry, I agree with much of what's on your list, but the affordable daycare sticks out as one I absolutely do not support.

Setting up a society where the institutionalization of infants and toddlers is the norm so that their parents can better serve the economy is completely wrong-headed. Most parents are the best determinants of what's in their own family's best interests - not the government, not other taxpayers, not voters.

If we are to provide funding to ensure families are able to make the choices that are best for them, their circumstances and their children, we don't support dumping all the money into funding institutions.

Promising universal affordable daycare was but one of the leftward lurches that pulled the Liberal Party of Canada too far away from my centrist happy place. I'm all for a government that models living within our means, but not one that impedes our right to make lifestyle choices on the most fundamental of basics.

Happy polling!
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by The Green Barbarian »

rustled wrote:Merry, I agree with much of what's on your list, but the affordable daycare sticks out as one I absolutely do not support.

Setting up a society where the institutionalization of infants and toddlers is the norm so that their parents can better serve the economy is completely wrong-headed. Most parents are the best determinants of what's in their own family's best interests - not the government, not other taxpayers, not voters.
You make good points Rustled. The daycare experiment was tried in Quebec and turned out to be a monumental failure. The number one users of free daycare? People on welfare. What?? Others who wanted to use it couldn't due to work schedules, and of course, being Quebec, all the "free" daycares had to be unionized, which meant that the care-givers didn't care about providing workable hours for working parents. It was just a massive joke. Which you always expect when the government gets involved, in pretty much anything. Governments should regulate, but never run anything. They suck at it, big time.
Justin Trudeau- racist, elitist, liar. What a sick piece of garbage.

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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by Hurtlander »

rustled wrote:Merry, I agree with much of what's on your list, but the affordable daycare sticks out as one I absolutely do not support.

Setting up a society where the institutionalization of infants and toddlers is the norm so that their parents can better serve the economy is completely wrong-headed. Most parents are the best determinants of what's in their own family's best interests - not the government, not other taxpayers, not voters.

If we are to provide funding to ensure families are able to make the choices that are best for them, their circumstances and their children, we don't support dumping all the money into funding institutions.

Promising universal affordable daycare was but one of the leftward lurches that pulled the Liberal Party of Canada too far away from my centrist happy place. I'm all for a government that models living within our means, but not one that impedes our right to make lifestyle choices on the most fundamental of basics.

Happy polling!
I think a happy medium would be for the government to provide ample incentive to build more daycare spaces, but I don’t think that daycare should ever be free or subsidised for anyone except those at the very bottom of the household income bracket. It should be more important to teach people how to live within their means, and how to budget, than to keep giving them free stuff.... Maybe I’m just showing my age.
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by hobbyguy »

In the last election, 33% of Canadians did not vote. Was that because they do not have a "political home" or because they simply do not engage?

Perhaps the most accurate assessment of those who do not vote is a bit old, but it is here: https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11- ... 01-eng.htm

So roughly 27% of non voters were simply not interested, and another 22% saw their vote as unimportant enough to state "too busy" as their reason for not voting.

Also a bit old, but telling, is a low ongoing engagement. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/89- ... ng.htm#a21

Roughly 37% of Canadians remain politically engaged on an ongoing basis. Importantly, the group that stay politically engaged is dominated by those with post secondary education.

Those who stay politically engaged will drive political party policy in most political parties. Mechanisms are in place in some parties to ensure that "grass roots" adopted resolutions become party policy and platform planks. Actual participation as political party members is relatively low.

Some single issue advocacy groups will pick a political party and attempt to push their agenda by "flooding the zone. This would not be possible if more Canadians were continuously engaged. https://www.itstartsrightnow.ca/members ... al_parties In that particular case, the information slants their members to the CPC as they list primarily CPC mechanisms/procedures.

That low ongoing engagement participation is bound to result in political parties that can get out of step with folks. For example: If politicians engagement with "the grassroots" is stilted by activist advocates, then that will unduly influence their views on what is appropriate policy and what voters want.

No matter how you slice it, participation in political parties is dominated by those with the means/inclination to have a post secondary education - which is an incomplete worldview perspective that is bound to lead to some disconnects. Further skewing the positions is that $money$ talks in political parties, which is an ongoing barrier to democratic improvement and political party participation (e.g. most political party conventions require a significant expense outlay by attendees for entry plus travel/accommodation etc.). The $money$ aspect tends to drive voter cynicism.

The "catch 22" is that those who do not engage with political parties on an ongoing basis will have their views underrepresented, and thus less are less likely to be able to find a "political home".

None of that is necessarily detrimental to democracy, with the exception of the $money$ aspect which is highly corrupting. A high level of folks without a "political home" could lead to more objectivity at the ballot box.
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Re: Majority of Canadians feeling politically homeless

Post by rustled »

Hurtlander wrote:
rustled wrote:Merry, I agree with much of what's on your list, but the affordable daycare sticks out as one I absolutely do not support.

Setting up a society where the institutionalization of infants and toddlers is the norm so that their parents can better serve the economy is completely wrong-headed. Most parents are the best determinants of what's in their own family's best interests - not the government, not other taxpayers, not voters.

If we are to provide funding to ensure families are able to make the choices that are best for them, their circumstances and their children, we don't support dumping all the money into funding institutions.

Promising universal affordable daycare was but one of the leftward lurches that pulled the Liberal Party of Canada too far away from my centrist happy place. I'm all for a government that models living within our means, but not one that impedes our right to make lifestyle choices on the most fundamental of basics.

Happy polling!
I think a happy medium would be for the government to provide ample incentive to build more daycare spaces, but I don’t think that daycare should ever be free or subsidised for anyone except those at the very bottom of the household income bracket. It should be more important to teach people how to live within their means, and how to budget, than to keep giving them free stuff.... Maybe I’m just showing my age.
It's not just about building more daycare spaces.

Daycares are, by necessity, designed around a five-day work week. This means parents on shifts and parents who work part time are paying through their taxes for daycare they can't use, and paying from their own pockets for daycare that does meet their families needs.

Worse, though: It used to matter a great deal to us, as a society AND as parents, that we allow our infants and toddlers to get the sleep they needed as their wee brains rewired and their little bodies grew. Today, infants and toddlers must be wakened in time for daycare so the parents can "serve the economy" regardless of the consequences for their children.

Any political party that works to make this more necessary ought to be stepping back and taking a long hard look at their priorities. Parents ought to have the right to choose how their childcare funds are used, for example having a responsible adult of their choice fill the gap between one parent leaving for work at 7.a.m. and the other arriving from their night shift at 8, or between after school and the first parent home, etc.
Ideology...gives evil-doing its long-sought justification and gives the evildoer the necessary steadfastness and determination...[it] is the social theory which helps to make his actions seem good instead of bad in his own and others' eyes...
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