Cali is Burning

Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Merry » Nov 12th, 2018, 7:17 pm

Omnitheo wrote:There are a lot of houses in between trees here too.

One summer when we were camped in Blind Bay I commented to my hubby about how so many of the houses there are nestled in among the trees, and how I'd hate to be living in one of them in the event of a forest fire.

Why don't municipalities regulate this kind of thing?
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Drip_Torch » Nov 12th, 2018, 9:23 pm

Merry wrote:Why don't municipalities regulate this kind of thing?


They do, to an extent. There's a bit of cognitive dissonance, it won't happen to me, fueled by 70 years of fire suppression with a remarkable record of being able to prevent urban conflagrations. There's a bit of "doors equal dollars" resistance at the local government level that needs to be constantly balanced.

Really, the BC experience is relatively new and I think we've been fumbling around with the notion that there is a quick fix, or a tweak we can make that'll make it all okay again. Perhaps some are hanging onto the notion that this too shall pass. I've been watching this for years, and after every bad year we seem to plot a course of action that reinforces the idea that the status quo is somehow achievable if we just do this, or that.

I'll try to give you a little perspective on what just happened in Paradise with the Camp Fire. Remember OMP, 2003? Well that fire started on August 16th and by August 23rd 26,000 people were being/had been evacuated out of the way. By September 20th it was 25,912 ha and everybody was back home.

The Camp Fire started on November 8th and today it is almost twice as big as the OMP fire was. Currently there are 42 fatalities and there is 228 people still missing. (I suspect most of them just haven't checked in with anyone yet.) There simply wasn't time to plan for an evacuation and many were left with few options. It's a growing concern I've been trying to share here on Castanet for a few years now. If evacuation is plan A - what is plan B? I suspect we'll need to figure that out in the next decade.

The message seems to be evolving quickly down in California. There's a Red Flag warning in place - if you smell smoke it's time to go. Have two routes out of where you live. I've been listening to lots of the dispatch calls over the last few days and "shelter in place", although a last alternative seems to be an option that they've been going to.

Here, to give you some idea how big this fire is I've done a comparison in local terms.

compare.jpg


Imagine, the entire east side from OMP to OK falls and beyond burned off in 3 days? Thankfully, we don't see that kind of fire behaviour here.

Merry, the only other thing I can tell you is that I sit in the back of room anytime WUI fires is on our local gov't agendas. Sometimes I snicker, sometimes I shrug, but I can tell you in all honesty that I've never come across a local politician that isn't concerned with the topic. They're "woke", and as such I think we'll see a measured approach that moves towards more regulation with WUI fires in mind.
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Queen K » Nov 13th, 2018, 7:34 am

Here I thought there was nothing lower than a snakes belly in a rut in a ditch. I was wrong.
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Cactusflower » Nov 13th, 2018, 12:58 pm

And all Trump can do is kick Californians while they're down.

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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Solipsistic » Nov 13th, 2018, 11:12 pm

*removed*
Last edited by ferri on Nov 14th, 2018, 6:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Wrong forum.

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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Drip_Torch » Nov 13th, 2018, 11:54 pm

:topic:
Last edited by Drip_Torch on Nov 14th, 2018, 9:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Jx3 » Nov 14th, 2018, 9:29 am

Drip_Torch wrote:The message seems to be evolving quickly down in California. There's a Red Flag warning in place - if you smell smoke it's time to go.


We'd be out of our house most of the summer if we did that.
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Jx3 » Nov 14th, 2018, 9:30 am

Cactusflower wrote:And all Trump can do is kick Californians while they're down.


Oh good, lets turn EVERY thread into a Trump-bashing thread.
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Omnitheo » Nov 14th, 2018, 10:40 am

He spoke up about the fires, so yeah he’s on topic in this thread. At least as far as his lack of sensibility and empathy towards victims of urban infrastructure fires (which he blames forest management for...)
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby normaM » Nov 14th, 2018, 10:52 am

Was reading more about it this morning.. interesting the Utility Co is being blamed
Terrible - so many dead and missing
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/californi ... -1.4904399
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Jflem1983 » Nov 14th, 2018, 10:53 am

normaM wrote:Was reading more about it this morning.. interesting the Utility Co is being blamed
Terrible - so many dead and missing
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/californi ... -1.4904399



I posted that info on the first day PGE is in trouble
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Drip_Torch » Nov 14th, 2018, 11:23 am

Jx3 wrote:
Drip_Torch wrote:The message seems to be evolving quickly down in California. There's a Red Flag warning in place - if you smell smoke it's time to go.


We'd be out of our house most of the summer if we did that.


Fair enough. California fuels are generally flashy fuels and fires don't get quite so heavily seated. To add a little context, that was a ventura county fire official and that far south it is unusual to get into protracted campaign fires. With the Santa Ana's the smoke plume and the fire generally get blown straight out into the Pacific.
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby ferri » Nov 14th, 2018, 2:01 pm

These are the victims of the California wildfires

The third one, Debbe Morningstar was a friend of mine. I swear, I could have been sinking in quicksand and she could have made me laugh.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-m ... story.html
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby gman313 » Nov 14th, 2018, 2:24 pm

ferri wrote:These are the victims of the California wildfires

The third one, Debbe Morningstar was a friend of mine. I swear, I could have been sinking in quicksand and she could have made me laugh.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-m ... story.html



sorry to hear - what a tragedy I just can't imagine dealing with fires that intense
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Re: Cali is Burning

Postby Drip_Torch » Nov 14th, 2018, 10:22 pm

A quick look at the grim numbers.

The Camp fire 56 fatalities found so far. 49 in Paradise and 7 in neighbouring Concow. Seven were found in cars, one was outside a vehicle, 13 were found outside homes and 35 were located inside structures. There's about 280 people still unaccounted for. I looked over a list published this afternoon and I'd estimate the average age of the missing people is somewhere in the mid to upper 70's.

At least 10,321 structures have been destroyed. 8650 homes, 260 commercial buildings.

What happened? Paradise sits on a bit of bench between two shallow draws on either side of it. The fire spread quickly and there is one major road, and two minor roads out of town. 27,000 people all hit the road at once, creating grid lock, panic and accidents - all the while the fire was flanking the evacuation route. Many were forced to flee their vehicles.

Unfortunately, it appears to me those numbers are still subject to change.

A terrible fire, with many lessons to be learned over the next few months.

Meanwhile down south, the Woolsey Fire has taken three lives. Two in a vehicle and one in a residence.

It appears the red flag warnings are down, but there’s still a lot of work to be done on the Camp fire, which currently has 52,000 people evacuated.
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