Ukraine war/President/news

[seewood]

Russia certainly felt threatened by NATO expansion, and expressed that view over a period of decades.

The reverse is true with the countries that were in the Warsaw Pact prior to 1991. However they felt threatened by their previous master, Russia, so joining NATO and the EU was a solution to let those countries plot their own path and not have meddling from corrupt Russia.

I suspect many in Russia do believe that NATO is a reactionary force and have no intentions to invade anyone. Saying that, Russia is embarrassed about losing their sphere of influence, including Ukraine so a lot of bellicose saber rattling is the result.
Ukraine is not a NATO member so Pootin thought it was low hanging fruit to reintroduce the Russian way of doing things.
Ukraine wanted to join the EU and NATO but the Russian friendly governments in the past wanted nothing to do with that however the greater population did and still does.
Consequently we now have a disillusioned master in Russia thinking Ukraine would be a cakewalk to occupy and install a Russian friendly government with the greater population of Ukraine taking exception to that notion.

[gertlush]

Russia certainly felt threatened by NATO expansion, and expressed that view over a period of decades.

The reverse is true with the countries that were in the Warsaw Pact prior to 1991. However they felt threatened by their previous master, Russia, so joining NATO and the EU was a solution to let those countries plot their own path and not have meddling from corrupt Russia.

I suspect many in Russia do believe that NATO is a reactionary force and have no intentions to invade anyone. Saying that, Russia is embarrassed about losing their sphere of influence, including Ukraine so a lot of bellicose saber rattling is the result.
Ukraine is not a NATO member so Pootin thought it was low hanging fruit to reintroduce the Russian way of doing things.
Ukraine wanted to join the EU and NATO but the Russian friendly governments in the past wanted nothing to do with that however the greater population did and still does.
Consequently we now have a disillusioned master in Russia thinking Ukraine would be a cakewalk to occupy and install a Russian friendly government with the greater population of Ukraine taking exception to that notion.

Nothing here that hasn't been rebutted before, it just keeps going in circles. At the end of the day though Russia will impose its will on Ukraine. We're 13 months in and the collective Western leadership still has no plan.

[gertlush]

Russian LNG imports to Europe increased 20% from 2021 to 2022. I guess just buying time until higher priced Yankee gas can fill the void?

And this idea that the West is going to rearm... look at Canadian procurement of subs, helis, jets. Jeess.. in 2050 we will finally place an order for some Sopwith Camels.

[seewood]

Russian LNG imports to Europe increased 20% from 2021 to 2022. I guess just buying time until higher priced Yankee gas can fill the void?

And this idea that the West is going to rearm... look at Canadian procurement of subs, helis, jets. Jeess.. in 2050 we will finally place an order for some Sopwith Camels.

And this has what to do with Ukraine war and the invasion by Russians?

Although nothing to do with Ukraine, it is criminal that Canadian men and women in the armed forces are given, for the most part, antique equipment to work with. Currently our Navy is a joke., Air Force's equipment is older than most if not all the men and women in that service.
I'd like to believe the training is very good and the troops are motivated, but successive governments of all stripes have let our armed forces down.

"Jeess.. in 2050 we will finally place an order for some Sopwith Camels."

something to that: In WW2 and the battle to sink the Bismark, the Bismark's guns had issues with shooting the Fairly Swordfish bi-plane torpedo bombers down as they were so slow the Bismark's guns would over lead them and miss.

[gertlush]

2 points - the sanctions are a joke, and the might of NATO is anything but. So for us to bluster and threaten Russia is ridiculous.

[Mazdatruck]

The reverse is true with the countries that were in the Warsaw Pact prior to 1991. However they felt threatened by their previous master, Russia, so joining NATO and the EU was a solution to let those countries plot their own path and not have meddling from corrupt Russia.

Russia was as broke as a 3rd world country after the fall of the iron curtain.

The CIA orchestrated who took over. They bragged about it it on the cover of Time magazine.

There is zero evidence NATO expansion post Soviet collapse was due to fear of the collapsed, broke and broken newly formed Russian country rolling over Europe in tanks.

Scary Russia...with the CIA's man in Moscow!

[gertlush]

Amnesty Intl says Wests reaction to Ukraine war exposes our hypocrisy and double standards.

Dirty commie bunch eh? Lets send em to Guantanamo!

[Thinktank]

According to you Thinktank, only your bedmate Putin could do no wrong, everyone else is a rat or warmonger.

But I changed my mind.

To all the warmongers on this thread - I agree with you now - I want this war to continue as long as it takes.

It would be great if this war reached not just cities with names like Bakhmut
but if Berlin and Dresden could be melted like glass - I would love it. Dresden knows already what war pigs can do.

If London the second home of the elite war pigs of planet earth could be annihilated - as long as it takes.

If by some miracle Putin could blow up Montreal where Melanie Joly lives it would be

God, give the Russians the ability to wage this war as long as it takes to take out every war pig in the West.



Ukraine war News - most of the world supports Putin. Listen to the first two minutes to learn what people
think of NATO.

BAD NATO

..

[seewood]

There is zero evidence NATO expansion post Soviet collapse was due to fear of the collapsed, broke and broken newly formed Russian country rolling over Europe in tanks.

Well, thats your opinion : https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_52044.htm

Snip: "It concluded that the end of the Cold War provided a unique opportunity to build improved security in the entire Euro-Atlantic area and that NATO enlargement would contribute to enhanced stability and security for all."

Snip :: The fall of the Berlin Wall and the dissolution of the Warsaw Pact after the end of the Cold War opened up the possibility of further NATO enlargement. Some of the new democracies of Central and Eastern Europe were eager to become integrated into Euro-Atlantic institutions.

So, why were they " eager" to join NATO ?

snip: Czechia, Hungary and Poland were invited to begin accession talks at the Alliance's Madrid Summit in 1997 and on 12 March 1999 they became the first former members of the Warsaw Pact to join NATO.

Next up : "Bulgaria, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania, Slovakia and Slovenia were invited to begin accession talks at the Alliance's Prague Summit in 2002. On 29 March 2004, they officially became members of the Alliance, making this the largest wave of enlargement in NATO history. "

After all that, it is apparent the ex warsaw pact countries would rather be Euro-centric and not corrupt Russia centric.

[Mazdatruck]

Well, thats your opinion : https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_52044.htm

Snip: "It concluded that the end of the Cold War provided a unique opportunity to build improved security in the entire Euro-Atlantic area and that NATO enlargement would contribute to enhanced stability and security for all."

Snip :: The fall of the Berlin Wall and the dissolution of the Warsaw Pact after the end of the Cold War opened up the possibility of further NATO enlargement. Some of the new democracies of Central and Eastern Europe were eager to become integrated into Euro-Atlantic institutions.

So, why were they " eager" to join NATO ?

Same reason Ukraine was "eager" to put Hunter Biden on Burisma's energy board.

Corruption, greed, western promises of riches. Those countries were gutted and stripped of all their $$$, sold out to western business interests who had first dibs on what the citizens of said countries owned.

Also fear as you're either with the USA or against them. Coercion.

After all that, it is apparent the ex warsaw pact countries would rather be Euro-centric and not corrupt Russia centric.

NATO is Westerncentric, not Eurocentric.

Nobody said these countries didnt want to join Russia. Nobody asked them to join Russia.

You suggested these countries joined NATO because they were afraid of the broken/broke newly formed Russian Government that was installed by the CIA, taking over their countries.

Poland was afraid that the CIA would tell Yeltsin to invade Poland?

[Mazdatruck]

NATO expansionism has so far resulted in over 100,000 Ukrainians being killed, the complete destruction of Ukraine and now we're on the brink of World War 3. NATO expansionism was not without consequences, contrary to the assertions. We're now talking about global nuclear war regularly and nuclear weapons are being placed in the field.

Nobody is safer today than 25 years ago. We're all much closer to death from a nuclear bomb thanks to NATO expansionism.

What have we gotten from NATO expansionism? How has the typical Canadians life been improved? We have all had to have reduced service levels, we all pay more taxes and our citizens here in Canada are all told to get in line behind Ukrainian refugees for places to live.

Who will we be holding responsible for NATO expansion miscalculations and false assertions of safety?

Many voices cautioned against expanding NATO when there was no reason too. They said it would lead to another arms race and push Russia to defend themselves. All these things came true.

Are we just blaming Putin for our own actions now?

[Mazdatruck]

What do you get for expanding NATO fellow Canadian?

People like the Biden's and Trudeau's will get rich.

What will you get?

Will you get a feeling of "spreading freedom"?

A feeling of "moral superiority"?

You're certainly be asked to give up things for such a payout. Less medical care. Less housing. Less everything.

Just like how car companies promise you'll feel "freedom" if you buy a red convertible...

The empty promise of a sentiment/emotional payout.

[65deluxe]

What do you get for expanding NATO fellow Canadian?

People like the Biden's and Trudeau's will get rich.

What will you get?

Will you get a feeling of "spreading freedom"?

A feeling of "moral superiority"?

You're certainly be asked to give up things for such a payout. Less medical care. Less housing. Less everything.

Just like how car companies promise you'll feel "freedom" if you buy a red convertible...

The empty promise of a sentiment/emotional payout.

You pretty much nail it, but most people are to stupid to realize it.

[seewood]

NATO expansionism has so far resulted in over 100,000 Ukrainians being killed, the complete destruction of Ukraine and now we're on the brink of World War 3.

Russian expansionism has resulted in 100,000 being killed. The destruction of eastern Ukraine, not all of Ukraine, and we are not on the brink of WW3 because of Ukraine, Taiwan perhaps but not Ukraine.

: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-56720589

Snip:

His declared goal on 24 February 2022 was to "demilitarise and denazify" Ukraine and not occupy it by force, days after backing independence for eastern Ukrainian territories occupied by Russian proxy forces since 2014.

He vowed to protect people from eight years of Ukrainian bullying and genocide - a Russian propaganda claim with no foundation in reality.

President Putin never said it out loud, but high on the agenda was toppling the government of Ukraine's elected president. "The enemy has designated me as target number one; my family is target number two," said Volodymyr Zelensky. Russian troops made two attempts to storm the presidential compound, according to his adviser.

Russian claims of Ukrainian Nazis committing genocide never added up, but Russian state-run news agency Ria Novosti explained that "denazification is inevitably also de-Ukrainisation" - in effect, erasing the modern state of Ukraine.

Pootins desire to keep NATO out of Ukraine would be easier if he did not invade Ukraine as ALL the members currently in NATO would have to vote positively to have Ukraine join. Currently Turkey is holding up Sweden's acceptance because of some Kurdish rebel nonsense.
Russia, with Pootin at the helm, is an insecure wanna-be country, but with the corruption and incompetence, has shown Russia is having difficulty being a player on the world stage, other than the fact they have more nukes than anyone. And that is the reason NO ONE (country) will invade Russia!

Wonder why the hate-on about Ukraine? What is the solution to stop this? Is it to have Ukrainians lay down their arms and let Russia impose their corrupt ways on Ukrainian citizens?

[Silverstarqueen]

It would be more than Russia imposing their ways on Ukraine. There would be a massacre first, perhaps with a facade of addressing "war crimes" that Ukrainians have committed. So Ukrainian soldiers have a pretty simple choice right now, possibly die defending Ukraine against Russia, or likely dying in the aftermath. No guarantee the Russians would not also murder, rape, enslave, steal everything from the remaining women, children, and old folks who did nothing more than try to escape bombs. So it's not a choice between a nice life under Russian rule, and dying in warfare.