The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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The Green Barbarian
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

Post by The Green Barbarian »

marvin gardens wrote: Nov 22nd, 2022, 8:21 pm Of course it is the socialistic governments and rent controls that are the problem, or so they argue.
And they are 100% right.
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BC Landlord
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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Patron wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 12:50 pm I don't know why you keep comparing BC to Alberta and yet say you know about supply and demand so much ?
....
these are the Vacancy Rates in Calgary and Edmonton, why so high there ? because the supply and demand has been met and that isn't unusual for a area where there's less mountains ( cheaper, easier to build) and it has a much colder, harsher climate during the winter mths. And those are decent numbers
Because I can, and because it's a glaring example of a good and highly functional housing market. People don't flock to places because of mountains, nice beaches, and pot. Otherwise, Calgary wouldn't be a place with 1.4M population, almost twice as much as Vancouver and Kelowna combined. So, obviously there is a huge demand for rentals, and more importantly, adequately met with supply. And guess what, ... no rent controls. But that's not something our government wants you to believe.
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spooker
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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BC Landlord wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 9:31 am
Nedroj wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 8:47 am In BC with the high demand for rental housing, we need regulations to ensure a level playing field. If we didn't have the high demand, like it is in Alberta, then we can drop or loosen the regulations.
And what makes you think Kelowna has a higher demand than Calgary, for example?
The fact that Calgary has not had a vacancy rate below 3.9% in the last 5 years while Kelowna has had the lowest vacancy rate in the country and still is sitting around 2.1%

https://globalnews.ca/news/3886556/kelo ... e-country/
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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BC Landlord wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 3:45 pm
Patron wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 12:50 pm I don't know why you keep comparing BC to Alberta and yet say you know about supply and demand so much ?
....
these are the Vacancy Rates in Calgary and Edmonton, why so high there ? because the supply and demand has been met and that isn't unusual for a area where there's less mountains ( cheaper, easier to build) and it has a much colder, harsher climate during the winter mths. And those are decent numbers
Because I can, and because it's a glaring example of a good and highly functional housing market. People don't flock to places because of mountains, nice beaches, and pot. Otherwise, Calgary wouldn't be a place with 1.4M population, almost twice as much as Vancouver and Kelowna combined. So, obviously there is a huge demand for rentals, and more importantly, adequately met with supply. And guess what, ... no rent controls. But that's not something our government wants you to believe.
[icon_lol2.gif] ok, keep on comparing 2 Provinces with totally different climates ( location is everything in RE) and don't forget that half this Valley is second home Albertans enjoying the same climate :D the numbers support "demand" here in BC they don't in Alberta
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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spooker wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 4:48 pm The fact that Calgary has not had a vacancy rate below 3.9% in the last 5 years while Kelowna has had the lowest vacancy rate in the country and still is sitting around 2.1%

https://globalnews.ca/news/3886556/kelo ... e-country/
There is no doubt Calgary's housing market is in a much better shape than Kelowna's, and it's always been. The question is WHY? When it comes to vacancy rate, the demand is only one side of the picture. What really matters is the supply. And you can't have a healthy supply when you throw hurdles in front of suppliers. Overregulation (rent controls) is one of those hurdles, a significant one.
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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Patron wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 5:09 pm [icon_lol2.gif] ok, keep on comparing 2 Provinces with totally different climates ( location is everything in RE) and don't forget that half this Valley is second home Albertans enjoying the same climate :D the numbers support "demand" here in BC they don't in Alberta
Believe it or not, the vast majority of people go after prosperity, rather than pleasure. 1.4M Calgary's population is the testament to that. Supplying that market with housing is a monumental task. And I am not saying it's much easier somewhere else, including Kelowna, but perhaps we should take a note of how our neighbors are doing it. And the biggest difference sits in the regulation. Namely, .. rent controls.
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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A fair bit easier to build in Calgary, terrain wise
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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gertlush wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 5:51 pm A fair bit easier to build in Calgary, terrain wise
:up: indeed it is
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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captkirkcanada wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 10:48 am
GordonH wrote: Nov 22nd, 2022, 6:19 pm

I guess you and other like minded landlords should be talking to Kevin Falcon about dropping Rent Controls in BC. Once BC Liberals/United Party takes over government of BC.
Wont happen lol that is a losing strategy . :up:
If so, landlords will just have to suck it up then.

Each time a renter moves out, this enables landlord to increase rent to current market prices. According to global BC 1 bedroom apartment is going for $2,000 per/month in Kelowna area. Ouch
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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BC Landlord wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 5:10 pm
spooker wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 4:48 pm The fact that Calgary has not had a vacancy rate below 3.9% in the last 5 years while Kelowna has had the lowest vacancy rate in the country and still is sitting around 2.1%

https://globalnews.ca/news/3886556/kelo ... e-country/
There is no doubt Calgary's housing market is in a much better shape than Kelowna's, and it's always been. The question is WHY? When it comes to vacancy rate, the demand is only one side of the picture. What really matters is the supply. And you can't have a healthy supply when you throw hurdles in front of suppliers. Overregulation (rent controls) is one of those hurdles, a significant one.
The answer to the WHY is simple. In Calgary, there is endless room to grow and not all neighborhoods are built the same. Some Subdivision lots are very small and contain only a detached house with no garage, while other lots are slightly bigger that can have a detached garage, while others are bigger and can have an attached garage. Then there are estate-style subdivisions that have lots around the .5acre size for those that want a bit more room. These allow custom homes to be built whereas the others are basic cookie-cutter homes sold for significantly less.

In Kelowna, All subdivisions for single detached houses are built the same. All high-end homes with high-end features in high-end neighborhoods. I blame this on the city council for not allowing a mix of high-end and low-end buildings. It's always the same complaint from them. Its doesn't look "WorldClass" or they think the developer could do better in terms of building "Green". All these do is raise the cost of building and buying that home. There are no homes being built that target the middle class and the city wonders where all the middle-class people are.

Right now, people just need basic homes, not 3,000 sqft estate mansions next to vineyards and orchards.
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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captkirkcanada wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 10:53 am Based on what ? What part of the act in bc is putting landlords as the victim ? Zero . 95 percent of landlords in bc never had it so good rents went wayyyyyy up and they didnt have to spend a cent lol. Go ask ppl without homes living on the street if they were a landlord last year . I bet not one will. Rent controls work and bc needs more .
If you're right and 95 percent are prospering, it's irrelevant. That just means that 95 percent of Landlords and Tenants are working well together and have a mutually beneficial relationship. It really just means those are the good people out there.

"Based on what?". I take it you've never been a landlord to a bad tenant or heard the stories from landlords of their struggles. I could list a bunch of anecdotes to support the reasons for why I think landlords need more protection from tenants, but how many people change their mind on the internet because of someone elses anecdotes?
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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Nedroj wrote: Nov 24th, 2022, 7:48 am
BC Landlord wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 5:10 pm
There is no doubt Calgary's housing market is in a much better shape than Kelowna's, and it's always been. The question is WHY? When it comes to vacancy rate, the demand is only one side of the picture. What really matters is the supply. And you can't have a healthy supply when you throw hurdles in front of suppliers. Overregulation (rent controls) is one of those hurdles, a significant one.
The answer to the WHY is simple. In Calgary, there is endless room to grow and not all neighborhoods are built the same. Some Subdivision lots are very small and contain only a detached house with no garage, while other lots are slightly bigger that can have a detached garage, while others are bigger and can have an attached garage. Then there are estate-style subdivisions that have lots around the .5acre size for those that want a bit more room. These allow custom homes to be built whereas the others are basic cookie-cutter homes sold for significantly less.

In Kelowna, All subdivisions for single detached houses are built the same. All high-end homes with high-end features in high-end neighborhoods. I blame this on the city council for not allowing a mix of high-end and low-end buildings. It's always the same complaint from them. Its doesn't look "WorldClass" or they think the developer could do better in terms of building "Green". All these do is raise the cost of building and buying that home. There are no homes being built that target the middle class and the city wonders where all the middle-class people are.

Right now, people just need basic homes, not 3,000 sqft estate mansions next to vineyards and orchards.
:up:
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

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Nedroj wrote: Nov 24th, 2022, 7:48 am In Kelowna, All subdivisions for single detached houses are built the same. All high-end homes with high-end features in high-end neighborhoods. I blame this on the city council for not allowing a mix of high-end and low-end buildings. It's always the same complaint from them. Its doesn't look "WorldClass" or they think the developer could do better in terms of building "Green". All these do is raise the cost of building and buying that home. There are no homes being built that target the middle class and the city wonders where all the middle-class people are.

Right now, people just need basic homes, not 3,000 sqft estate mansions next to vineyards and orchards.
The city can dictate the size of lots through zoning. A problem is developers purchase a block of land with small lot zoning and before the ink is dry on the property purchase the developer is in front of council with a rezoning application for larger lots citing financial feasibility for bigger homes or some other BS reason. Many tracts of land in the valley that are flat and easy to build on, similar to Calgary, are tied up in the ALR. Solution, build on the surrounding hillsides or redevelop existing neighborhoods from single family to multi family town houses. Plenty of that happening in Penticton right now. But still not cheap by yesterdays standards.
When building on a hillside, the cost of installing infrastructure is considerably more expensive than digging up a previous orchard for example. This increased cost is reflected in the price of a lot, large or small and the house to be built on that lot will not be a small "cookie cutter" dwelling.

The Okanagan Valley is a nice place to live and many from other parts of Canada that have worked in other provinces are moving here to retire. The working lot are competing for housing with us old farts.
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

Post by captkirkcanada »

Patron wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 5:09 pm
BC Landlord wrote: Nov 23rd, 2022, 3:45 pm
Because I can, and because it's a glaring example of a good and highly functional housing market. People don't flock to places because of mountains, nice beaches, and pot. Otherwise, Calgary wouldn't be a place with 1.4M population, almost twice as much as Vancouver and Kelowna combined. So, obviously there is a huge demand for rentals, and more importantly, adequately met with supply. And guess what, ... no rent controls. But that's not something our government wants you to believe.
[icon_lol2.gif] ok, keep on comparing 2 Provinces with totally different climates ( location is everything in RE) and don't forget that half this Valley is second home Albertans enjoying the same climate :D the numbers support "demand" here in BC they don't in Alberta
Not based on rent competition it isnt . The places for rent tell the story , if a province has 4 percent plus places available there will be competion for renters . In bc we have a competition for highest rents lol . There is not enough supply for lower to middle bracket renters . It isnt rocket science for me but it is for sum .
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Re: The Reality Of No Rent Controls

Post by Nedroj »

seewood wrote: Nov 24th, 2022, 8:07 am
Nedroj wrote: Nov 24th, 2022, 7:48 am In Kelowna, All subdivisions for single detached houses are built the same. All high-end homes with high-end features in high-end neighborhoods. I blame this on the city council for not allowing a mix of high-end and low-end buildings. It's always the same complaint from them. Its doesn't look "WorldClass" or they think the developer could do better in terms of building "Green". All these do is raise the cost of building and buying that home. There are no homes being built that target the middle class and the city wonders where all the middle-class people are.

Right now, people just need basic homes, not 3,000 sqft estate mansions next to vineyards and orchards.
The city can dictate the size of lots through zoning. A problem is developers purchase a block of land with small lot zoning and before the ink is dry on the property purchase the developer is in front of council with a rezoning application for larger lots citing financial feasibility for bigger homes or some other BS reason. Many tracts of land in the valley that are flat and easy to build on, similar to Calgary, are tied up in the ALR. Solution, build on the surrounding hillsides or redevelop existing neighborhoods from single family to multi family town houses. Plenty of that happening in Penticton right now. But still not cheap by yesterdays standards.
When building on a hillside, the cost of installing infrastructure is considerably more expensive than digging up a previous orchard for example. This increased cost is reflected in the price of a lot, large or small and the house to be built on that lot will not be a small "cookie cutter" dwelling.

The Okanagan Valley is a nice place to live and many from other parts of Canada that have worked in other provinces are moving here to retire. The working lot are competing for housing with us old farts.
There are solutions to the housing issue but nobody is willing to even talk about it. The City, Potential Landowner and Potential Developer need to sit down and hammer out some compromises.

Here's an example:
ALR Landowner wants to retire and sell his nonfunctioning/poor-producing orchard.
The developer wants to buy the land but wants it out of ALR for development purposes.
ALR, Landowner and The City negotiate to allow the property out of ALR but under strict Development conditions in perpetuity.
Those conditions are that a certain percentage (TBD) of lots/houses will be built and sold at a reasonable cost to Canadian Families.
They cannot be sold as an investment, they cannot be sold to corporations or to anyone that doesn't hold a Canadian Passport.
In exchange, the developer will receive discounted DCC, fees, and other charges associated with developing a subdivision.
The Provincial and Federal governments should provide subsidies to these developers when they are doing these types of projects to promote them and in the hopes more will sign up to do the same.
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