What we can expect in the third millennium

Social, economic and environmental issues in our ever-changing world.
foenix
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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MAPearce wrote: Aug 24th, 2021, 4:56 pm
On the one hand you acknowledge the gap between the ultra-rich and the poorest has grown, and that it is the middle class who is stuck paying for the social programs. What do the ultra rich fear? Paying taxes like everyone else?
Nope ....

Not being able to earn a reward for the risk they take using their own money to make more ... Meantime providing people an opportunity to better themselves by having a decent paying job , that make the employer money ..

I know it sounds "weird" to you Ka el , but that's how it works ..

The rich DO pay taxes . Every dollar I make has a deduction for "social" programs ( CPP . OAS , EI ) and the "ultra rich" employer matches those deduction.. If THAT isn't a tax , that the "ultra poor" DON'T pay but get to collect for doing nothing , I'll eat your hat.
Really, could have fooled me......

Wealth tax would raise far more money than previously thought
Inequality has reached new heights in Canada in recent years. The richest 1% now control 25% of Canada’s wealth, according to a recent Parliamentary Budget Office (PBO) report. Research from the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives shows that the 87 richest families in the country each hold, on average, 4,448 times more wealth than the typical family. Together these 87 families hold more wealth than the bottom 12 million Canadians combined.

Inequality is linked to worse performance on a wide range of health and social outcomes, as international epidemiological research shows. High levels of inequality also damage economic growth, as organizations like the IMF and OECD have begun to acknowledge in recent years.

Tackling inequality with a wealth tax on the super rich is hugely popular, backed by an overwhelming majority of Canadians across party lines in the most recent polling. This approach is also supported by a growing body of economic research and analysis.

This paper provides a new estimate of the revenue potential of a wealth tax using up-to-date national accounts data and estimating tax avoidance and evasion based on the latest academic research. A 1% tax on wealth over $20 million in Canada would generate about $10 billion in revenue in its first year, substantially more than the commonly cited estimate of $5.6 billion.

With a $10 billion boost to annual public revenues, Canada could lift hundreds of thousands of people out of poverty, implement long-term increases to funding for important social programs like child care, health care and seniors care, and help pay for more ambitious climate action.
https://www.policynote.ca/tax-the-rich/
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MAPearce
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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Wealth tax would raise far more money than previously thought
A "wealth tax" would sent the wealthy to where there WASN'T a wealth tax ..
I payed attention in High school....But I didn't need too .
BC Landlord
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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foenix wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 1:44 pm Wealth tax would raise far more money than previously thought
That's been debunked time after time ... Tax revenues never increase proportionally to an increase in taxation, if any. Especially when it comes to wealthier segment of the population. Wealth is very mobile. Nowadays, it takes just a few mouse clicks, ... and off it's gone.
foenix
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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BC Landlord wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 5:26 pm
foenix wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 1:44 pm Wealth tax would raise far more money than previously thought
That's been debunked time after time ... Tax revenues never increase proportionally to an increase in taxation, if any. Especially when it comes to wealthier segment of the population. Wealth is very mobile. Nowadays, it takes just a few mouse clicks, ... and off it's gone.
See this part in the article.......
Tackling inequality with a wealth tax on the super rich is hugely popular, backed by an overwhelming majority of Canadians across party lines in the most recent polling. This approach is also supported by a growing body of economic research and analysis.

This paper provides a new estimate of the revenue potential of a wealth tax using up-to-date national accounts data and estimating tax avoidance and evasion based on the latest academic research. A 1% tax on wealth over $20 million in Canada would generate about $10 billion in revenue in its first year, substantially more than the commonly cited estimate of $5.6 billion.
......tells me it hasn't been debunked......if it has, please provide a link as your saying it's been debunked time and time again so it will be easy for you.
foenix
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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MAPearce wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 4:31 pm
Wealth tax would raise far more money than previously thought
A "wealth tax" would sent the wealthy to where there WASN'T a wealth tax ..
Then I guess they won't be Canadians and can do their business in those countries.
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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foenix wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 6:06 pm
MAPearce wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 4:31 pm

A "wealth tax" would sent the wealthy to where there WASN'T a wealth tax ..
Then I guess they won't be Canadians and can do their business in those countries.
Yeup .. They will , but Canadians still need what they produce and someone else in another country gets a job producing it ..

Canada moves to a socialist welfare state and goes broke because all the "ultra rich" have moved on .
I payed attention in High school....But I didn't need too .
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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MAPearce wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 6:11 pm
foenix wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 6:06 pm

Then I guess they won't be Canadians and can do their business in those countries.
Yeup .. They will , but Canadians still need what they produce and someone else in another country gets a job producing it ..

Canada moves to a socialist welfare state and goes broke because all the "ultra rich" have moved on .
I'm sure we will survive and make sure they take their businesses with them.
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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I'm sure we will survive and make sure they take their businesses with them.
I dunno about that ...

You own a home that needs a roof ? Because the "Green Crazy" millennials of this generation don't like our more ethically source oil , the cost of materials to replace it has jumped up to stupid from reasonable just to import it from countries that are less "tolerant" ...
I payed attention in High school....But I didn't need too .
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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BC Landlord wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 5:26 pm
foenix wrote: Aug 25th, 2021, 1:44 pm Wealth tax would raise far more money than previously thought
That's been debunked time after time ... Tax revenues never increase proportionally to an increase in taxation, if any. Especially when it comes to wealthier segment of the population. Wealth is very mobile. Nowadays, it takes just a few mouse clicks, ... and off it's gone.
When asked about the very real possibility of a wealth tax driving away the wealthy, Jagmeet Singh responded that the wealth tax will work because it costs the wealthy more money to move their dollars than they’d pay in the wealth tax. I just about did a spit-take. There are people who will believe him, though, because members of the general public don’t know anyone who is ultra-rich, so they won’t hear an opposing view on this subject. Media is selective on the narrative they choose to run with, so don’t count on getting the full truth from them. Although, I am very impressed that the reporter/journalist asked the question. They know more than the average citizen.

I don’t know anyone who is ultra-rich (by definition), yet I know two people who are well-off enough that it was worthwhile for them to leave Canada because of taxes. One of them is an in-law. The other was through work - he liquified everything, left the country with his money (and, yes, it did cost him) and he is now investing his money elsewhere.

Ain’t nobody here but us chickens. More scratch, please.
~
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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Rejigger wrote: Aug 26th, 2021, 6:36 pm
I don’t know anyone who is ultra-rich (by definition), yet I know two people who are well-off enough that it was worthwhile for them to leave Canada because of taxes. One of them is an in-law. The other was through work - he liquified everything, left the country with his money (and, yes, it did cost him) and he is now investing his money elsewhere.

Ain’t nobody here but us chickens. More scratch, please.
~
Did you even read the link? Did your well off peeps have over 20 million dollars? If not, they dont have to worry. If so, they would have to pay $200,000 on that $20,000,000 they have. I'm pretty sure percentage wise I pay way more.
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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foenix wrote: Aug 26th, 2021, 6:59 pm Did you even read the link? Did your well off peeps have over 20 million dollars? If not, they dont have to worry. If so, they would have to pay $200,000 on that $20,000,000 they have. I'm pretty sure percentage wise I pay way more.
In case it went over anyone else’s head, I will repeat that even though “my peeps” are not ultra-wealthy EVEN THEY found it worthwhile to leave Canada and take their money with them. Therefore, anybody who think the ultra-wealthy won’t find it worth their while to do the same, I’d suggest they put down that glass of kool-aid.

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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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Rejigger wrote: Aug 26th, 2021, 7:47 pm
foenix wrote: Aug 26th, 2021, 6:59 pm Did you even read the link? Did your well off peeps have over 20 million dollars? If not, they dont have to worry. If so, they would have to pay $200,000 on that $20,000,000 they have. I'm pretty sure percentage wise I pay way more.
In case it went over anyone else’s head, I will repeat that even though “my peeps” are not ultra-wealthy EVEN THEY found it worthwhile to leave Canada and take their money with them. Therefore, anybody who think the ultra-wealthy won’t find it worth their while to do the same, I’d suggest they put down that glass of kool-aid.

~
People move all the time to other countries for various reason........nothing new there. If the ultra wealthy wants to move anytime, they can but I guess they won't be calling Canada home. I'm sure we will survive and they can make their money in another
country. Bon voyagee is what I would say to that. It's not like they are paying their share of income earned in this country, like the middle class are.
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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foenix wrote: Aug 26th, 2021, 8:01 pm
Rejigger wrote: Aug 26th, 2021, 7:47 pm
In case it went over anyone else’s head, I will repeat that even though “my peeps” are not ultra-wealthy EVEN THEY found it worthwhile to leave Canada and take their money with them. Therefore, anybody who think the ultra-wealthy won’t find it worth their while to do the same, I’d suggest they put down that glass of kool-aid.
People move all the time to other countries for various reason........nothing new there.
True but completely irrelevant to the situation being discussed - these people left because they were already heavily taxed.
If the ultra wealthy wants to move anytime, they can but I guess they won't be calling Canada home. I'm sure we will survive and they can make their money in another country.
Again, true. And I’m sure you can see how having fewer investments in Canada (fewer assets on our balance sheet, if you will) and fewer tax dollars coming in (less income, if you will) isn’t a good thing for the country.
Bon voyagee is what I would say to that. It's not like they are paying their share of income earned in this country, like the middle class are.
Mmmhmm. Again, when someone says they’re leaving because taxes are already too high, that means they’re paying “their share” of taxes.

Or are you suggesting that they’re doing something illegal, like tax evasion? In which case, why would they leave if they weren’t paying high taxes?

Like I wrote above, I’m impressed by the reporter/journalist who asked the question of Jagmeet Singh because they clearly know more than the average Joe Q Public.

*snap* <——- the camel’s back
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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Rejigger wrote: Or are you suggesting that they’re doing something illegal, like tax evasion? In which case, why would they leave if they weren’t paying high taxes?
Ummmm.......because they are in position to take advantage of these kinds of "tax evasion"........and they're still here and not paying high taxes because their money is hidden offshore or other ways.

Canada Has a Tax Haven Problem & Nothing Is Happening About It

https://nouvelle.news/2020/07/canada-ha ... -about-it/

More than 3,000 Canadian names in the Paradise Papers

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/paradi ... -1.4386126

CRA identifies nearly 900 Canadians in Panama Papers, 5 investigations underway

https://globalnews.ca/news/5124637/pana ... dians-cra/
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Re: What we can expect in the third millennium

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foenix wrote: Aug 26th, 2021, 8:01 pm country. Bon voyagee is what I would say to that. It's not like they are paying their share of income earned in this country, like the middle class are.
If you think the only contribution the ultra wealthy make to Canada is a lack of taxes, you don't understand how money works.

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