Campbell has to go..

BC's provincial election and STV referendum takes place Tuesday May 12th.
NAB
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Re: Campbell has to go..

Post by NAB »

Seems it is time for Ralph Sultan's (Liberal MLA in Campbells BC government) to circulate his annual package of musings. One of them can be found at: http://www.ralphsultan.com/Newsltr-2008 ... orial.html

Excerpts:

"So with the high priests of finance discredited, with reality unhinged from decades of received economic theory, we find ourselves today, in this province, only six months away from a provincial election, with socialist barbarians at the gates of Victoria, wondering how a small global trader such as British Columbia can continue to survive and prosper."

He goes on to list the standard Campbell government claims of achievements, then goes on to say..

"And yet, and yet – all of these accomplishments are now imperilled by a possible political takeover by what I would describe as the balance sheet challenged leaders of the left, starting with Mr. Layton who has a simple solution for every problem: raise taxes on Exxon and the banks.

What Mr. Layton – and for that matter all of us – must come to grips with is the new era of what may be termed the balance sheet economy. In this new economy, the key question is: who is credit worthy? What do the clients owe? Until lenders find comfort, credit will not flow freely. Can government substitute for the financial intermediary role? Not likely. Been there, done that, e.g. the Soviet Union. Doesn’t work."

*************************************

I for one am often taken to task for referring to the NDP (provincially and federally) as "socialists", but this guy goes a step further and refers to them as "socialist barbarians". (I'm pretty sure those who support the NDP, or potentially might, aren't going to be too happy about that description from one of our current "best"). Perhaps I have become brainwashed as to the true definition of what our NDP represents in our country.

Steven. Is Ralph wrong in using that term? Am I in your view albeit without the "barbarian" addon? I have asked before what they should be called (other than usually late for lunch), and so far have received no clear answer as to what they are or what they represent in terms of general Canadian philosophy.

Can you or anyone put us straight. After all, we only have about 5 months to make up our mind!

In any event, Ralph seems to be developing some concern that the Campbell Government may find itself in difficulty in the spring if it cannot convince us that "the socialist barbarians at the gates of Victoria" are a major threat to us, as well as "them".

Nab
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steven lloyd
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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Nabcom wrote: Steven. Is Ralph wrong in using that term? Am I in your view albeit without the "barbarian" addon? I have asked before what they should be called (other than usually late for lunch), and so far have received no clear answer as to what they are or what they represent in terms of general Canadian philosophy. Can you or anyone put us straight. After all, we only have about 5 months to make up our mind!
Nab



Can I put you straight ?!?!? :dyinglaughing:

Surely you jest. I would not presume such knowledge and insight. I only have my opinion which is based on my education, observation and experience. While I have been guilty of slamming others, I really do not make a claim to superior thought.

I do know this, though. Communism is as distinct from socialism, as socialism is from social democracy, and there is greater difference between those paradigms than Liberalism and conservatism. Over the decades, though, the media (owned and controlled by corporations) has done a magnificent job in contributing to the misinformation – not to mention many prominent politicians and figureheads.

For example, it is hardly fair to use the Soviet Union as an example to criticize government substitution in a financial intermediary role. The Soviet Union was a totalitarian government with no democratic process and completely irrelevant as a comparison in this case. It is only used to instil fear in those who are unable (or unwilling) to recognize that. I’m not here either supporting or criticizing government substitution in a financial intermediary role, but pointing out that a decision one way or the other should occur through some form of democratic process, and in our system (as flawed as it is), will.

Are the NDP socialist barbarians? Again, this in an effort by a politician to sway opinion by instilling fear. It is unfortunate, because he loses credibility in the eyes of those who do understand the difference, and even more unfortunate, sways the opinion of the majority who seem not to be able to understand through misinformation.

I’m still not yet completely sure who I’ll be voting for in five months, but like yourself, I’m completely convinced we need to get rid of Campbell and his “ilk”. I’m not confident with the current collective NDP offering (although I do like some), but as we’ve discussed, I think any damage they do in term will be more easily corrected than the damage that will occur after another term under Campbell’s agendas. I do know, that in theory, the NDP aspire to the platform of social democracy and that would be a good thing. In a true social democracy government would be accountable to people like you and me (not necessarily unions - as the fear mongers would try to have you believe).

Yup, we need to keep the “socialist barbarians” behind the gates of hell – so the Bull-$hitting politicians can keep feeding us crap.
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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OK, fair enough. Now, since you seem to assert there is a difference and list the various orientations, can you give a capsule overview of each philosophy, highlighting the differences related to each governmental pursuit in your view? i.e. financial, human rights, realtionshio with private sector business, privatization, etc etc, as well as where the current provincial NDP reside on those issues...

Thanks ;-)

Nab
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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Nabcom wrote:OK, fair enough. Now, since you seem to assert there is a difference and list the various orientations, can you give a capsule overview of each philosophy, highlighting the differences related to each governmental pursuit in your view? i.e. financial, human rights, realtionshio with private sector business, privatization, etc etc, as well as where the current provincial NDP reside on those issues...

Thanks ;-)

Nab


Yikes. Maybe, but not now. Gotta spend some time with my wife. I do remember a writer by the name of Robert Mullavy (I think that was his name) but I haven't been able to find him on the internet. He provided a very good encapsulation of each in his writings (a text from university). I always remember his one quote "Socialism is the least understood and most misunderstood of all political paradigms". Anyways, I gotta go right now, but maybe you can find something by him somewhere (you retired guys have more time). Bye for now.
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Re: Campbell has to go..

Post by Al Czervic »

Nabcom wrote:OK, fair enough. Now, since you seem to assert there is a difference and list the various orientations, can you give a capsule overview of each philosophy, highlighting the differences related to each governmental pursuit in your view? i.e. financial, human rights, realtionshio with private sector business, privatization, etc etc, as well as where the current provincial NDP reside on those issues...

Thanks ;-)

Nab


Sorry Nab, but Carole James and the provincial NDP are all over the map on all kinds of issues.

NDP says they oppose Carbon taxes; and yet they have their very own hidden Carbon Tax that has already been proven to be far more costly and less transparent that the current Carbon tax they are campaigning against.

Carole James said she opposed the pay increase for MLA’s and yet when given the chance to “opt out” of the pay and pension program; guess what – She cashes in at the trough. Even Harry Lali from the NDP said Carole James was a hypocrite on that.

NDP says they support the offsetting tax cuts from the Campbell Carbon tax even though they provide no explanation how they would keep them if elected.

Jack Layton says the NDP supports an inheritance tax that would tax away your life savings; Carole James says she does not think so. Who wins Layton or James ?

NDP voted against every tax cut the Campbell government brought in; and yet Carole James says she would not raise taxes if elected? How does this work?

When she was a school trustee Carole James said she supported standardized FSA testing in our school system. Now the BCTF wants to boycott them. What is Carole James position on this ? Hint…she refuses to take one.

Carole James says the NDP is not all about Unions anymore and yet she has appeared as a keynote speaker of every major Union convention since she was elected leader of the NDP – how do you reconcile that contradiction?

Carole James says she oppose hwy expansion and yet many of her MLA’s say they support it (an example is the Port Mann bridge expansion)

Carole James only took a position in support of the Tsawwassen treaty AFTER the fact it was voted on and signed. What kind of after the fact leadership is that ?

I could go on and on. I am not suggesting that all of the NDP MLA’s are so wishy washy. Many; like Harry Lali and Corky Evans are pretty clear where they stand on most issues. Carole James is ALL over the map and makes no sense on pretty much every issue. I am amazed that any educated person cannot see that.

Premier Campbell came out condemning the recent BS in Ottawa; asking all MP’s to work together. Where was Carole James on that issue? Hiding behind Jack Layton and his mustache.
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steven lloyd
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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Al Czervic wrote: Carole James is ALL over the map and makes no sense on pretty much every issue. I am amazed that any educated person cannot see that.


I think many educated, and even uneducated people see that Al. She is definitely a wild card (maybe she thinks she’s a “maverick”) and I still can’t believe the Party elected her to be leader. It is a scary thought that she might be premier of this province. In fact, there are only a few politicians (one in particular) in this province who scare me even more.
Last edited by steven lloyd on Dec 19th, 2008, 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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steven lloyd
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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THOUSANDS OF DRINKING DRIVERS PUT ON NOTICE

VANCOUVER – Up to 4,000 more British Columbians whose driving records show evidence of
drinking and driving will now be forced to provide breath samples every time they operate their
vehicles, under an expanded ignition interlock program announced today by Solicitor General John van Dongen.


I guess it will be taking Gordo a bit longer to get the car started though.

Oh, I forgot. he probably gets an exemption.
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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Jeesh. For all of Gordo's shots at the former NDP government, he is starting to make Glenn Clarke and honchos look like penny players in a game of Go Fish. Fast Ferry Fiasco and BingoGate included.

Nab

*****************************************************************************************8

Column: The Olympics' appetite for taxpayer money gargantuan and growing

The Vancouver Sun provided the front page from hell.

Bang: "Vancouver faces potential $875-million Olympic price tag."

Bang: "B.C. approves upgrading BC Place stadium for $365 million."

Bang: "B.C. balking at increased 2010 Olympics security budget."

A veritable trifecta of bad-news headlines for taxpayers.

The city of Vancouver admits it could be on the hook for the full cost of the Olympic village.

The province commits to a massive (and after the fact) renovation of the venue for the Games' opening and closing ceremonies.

The province fights being stuck with a bill for hundreds of millions of dollars for providing Olympic security.

In the wake of those stories, various politicians offered assurances to minimize the financial horrors.

The Vancouver guarantees were said to pose a "worst case" scenario. The site can probably be developed and sold, offsetting the outlays by the city.

The BC Place upgrade should also be covered by development of the surrounding lands, subject to (ahem) market conditions.

And provincial taxpayers were supposed to feel good that B.C. is fighting to reduce its share of a security bill approaching $1 billion, never mind that any balance would have to be picked up by federal taxpayers.

"There is only one taxpayer," to quote various politicians at moments when it suited them.

On that basis, the all-in tab associated with Friday's three stories could exceed $2 billion.

And counting, one has to add. For taxpayers have repeatedly been given lowball estimates for Games and Games-related facilities, only to discover, too late, that they couldn't take any of those numbers to the bank.

The Olympic village was supposedly self-financing, apart from a mere $30 million in shared backing from the federal and provincial governments.

BC Place? Three years ago, the B.C. Liberals budgeted a mere $2.5 million for renovations that have turned into a $365-million upgrade. "It is not anticipated that BC Place will need a significant capital infusion," minister for the Olympics Colin Hansen assured the legislature then.

The security budget provides its own fiscal pathology. The police and other experts have been saying for years that the supposed $175 million budget wouldn't begin to cover costs.

But senior governments are still refusing to provide an update, other than a federal government suggestion that it will be more than $400 million and less than $1 billion. This is a budget?

Nor does that exhaust the instances of Games-related-budget fudging.

One readily recalls the expansion of the convention centre, ramrodded to ensure it would be ready to serve as the media centre for 2010. Cost, approaching $900 million, almost double the original "budget."

At year's end the independent auditor-general delivered a reminder of the provincial government's failure to acknowledge a further $170 million in Olympic costs.

As to what other surprises might be coming down the road, I would just note that the Olympic sponsors include troubled Nortel and troubled General Motors.

Hansen again, from 2007: "Something that has been the bane of my existence is an obsession that certain members of the media have ... that the cost of the Games are out of control and it is going to cost way more than anyone says it is going to cost. There are days when I am absolutely convinced that there is no amount of facts that will dissuade somebody from a good story."

Well, minister, it remains a fact that when these Games were first pitched to British Columbians in 1998 they were assured that taxpayers would be on the hook for "only" $100 million.

It is also a fact that about that time my colleague, Ian Mulgrew, predicted in these pages that "hosting the 2010 Winter Games would cost taxpayers a fortune."

Others, including yours truly, would say much the same thing. But the admission fee for being able to say "I told you so" is steep, given that, as taxpayers, we're all on the same hook.

When the news broke Friday of Vancouver's worst case scenario, it was said on radio station CKNW that "somewhere" Jean Drapeau, late author of Montreal's Olympic overrun, was probably enjoying a good laugh.

But the laughs might have been closer to home, and coming from this world, not the next.

I'm thinking of former premier Glen Clark, who played a key role in lining up the 2010 Games for British Columbia before he left office.

Clark, now an executive with the Jim Pattison group, remains a fan of the Olympics, according to what he recently told reporter Rod Mickleburgh of the Globe and Mail.

Clark even floated the possibility that he would get an invitation to the opening ceremonies.

"Of course I guess Carole James will be premier by then," he couldn't resist adding.
"He who controls others may be powerful, but he who has mastered himself is mightier still." - Lao-Tzu
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steven lloyd
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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Nabcom wrote:Jeesh. For all of Gordo's shots at the former NDP government, he is starting to make Glenn Clarke and honchos look like penny players in a game of Go Fish. Fast Ferry Fiasco and BingoGate included.

Nab


Gotta make sure all his corporate buddies get paid their promised share in case he loses next election. Wonder what other "deals" he'll push through before then.
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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steven lloyd wrote:
Nabcom wrote:Jeesh. For all of Gordo's shots at the former NDP government, he is starting to make Glenn Clarke and honchos look like penny players in a game of Go Fish. Fast Ferry Fiasco and BingoGate included.

Nab


Gotta make sure all his corporate buddies get paid their promised share in case he loses next election. Wonder what other "deals" he'll push through before then.


Well, I will suggest that, given what looms for the Taxpayers of the Lower Mainland... he is burning bridges faster than he can build them. And that is his power base.

Edit to add: I would also like to suggest that any federal monies coming in BC's direction as a result of infrastructure spending to stimulate the economy be applied to costs associated with the Olympics before any new spending on projects takes place.

Nab
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Re: Campbell has to go..

Post by Smurf »

Are there any real surprises in the cost of the games. I expected all this right from the beginning and also expected the lying and cover ups by Campbell and his cronies as that is what they do best. The real surprise is how bad the economy is at a time when all these expenses are coming up. I was expecting a leveling off but now believe it could be much worse before it's over. I'm sure any infastructure payments coming from the federal government will be directed to the games. I'll bet none of the rest of the province sees anything if Campbell has any say.

Wonder if Campbell can figure out a way to increase pension benifits before the election. I'm sure our economy can afford another raise for them. Campbell is just lucky that he hit it when the economy was on a real upswing. He didn't have to do anything to look good. Then he sold off everything he could to make things look better. I have to agree with you Nab, when this is all over he will make the NDP look like angels. Our future generations will be paying for this one. Thanks Gordo.
Consider how hard it is to change yourself and you'll understand what little chance you have of changing others.

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Re: Campbell has to go..

Post by John500 »

What the Liberals under Gordo have done to the seniors of this province by taking away some of their priced retirement benefits and then later on giving themselves a nice pension package should make every senior turn away from this government. However Carole James just has not got it to capitalize on that. Maybe the NDP should let her go in order to stand a chance in the next election. But I guess they will not with their foolish rules and regulations of who can and cannot run in the ridings, their carbon tax proposals etc. So mark my words, another 4 years of Gordo and more and more out of touch policies from Victoria. BC, The best place on earth??? Yeah right!
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Re: Campbell has to go..

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Isn't it amazing how a Newfoundland judge has to resign his appointment (just before Xmas) over an impaired driving conviction from the 1980's before he was even a lawyer. Yet Gordo carries on like normal when he gets one while he is Premier. What a disgrace this man is to our province.

"I did genuinely forget about the impaired conviction [but] it nevertheless amounts to non-disclosure [and] I could not seek to have my appointment maintained for fear that it would impact the perception of the administration of justice," Singleton wrote.

"The public's view of the criminal justice system is already low (for reasons that have nothing to do with me)."


At least he is man enough to admit his mistakes. I guess Campbell doesn't think public opinion of politicians is low. Too bad he wouldn't come into the real world.
Consider how hard it is to change yourself and you'll understand what little chance you have of changing others.

The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the most of everything that comes their way.
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Re: Campbell has to go..

Post by NAB »

Seems to me Mr. Campbell is more about real estate "investment" and development (particularly in Vancouver region) than he is about being a Premier of a an entire province Smurf. The only difference I see between him and any other realtor/developer is that he gets to play with massive amounts of taxpayer dollars (and people's lives without their consent).

Obviously a very capable man, just entrusted with the wrong job. Non the less, he has the support of his political party as its leader - it will be interesting to see if he still has the support of the electors in his riding. They are the ones who ultimately have to take the responsibility for deciding if "he" gets to continue leading this province should his party win enough seats to form the next government.

All the rest of us can do is try to ensure his party does not win enough seats to govern or, if they do, make sure it is only by a majority of one or two seats so it would not be as easy to bully the opposition. IMO that cannot be achieved by me casting a vote for any party but the Liberals or the NDP. In the latter case I would have to hold my nose to do it, but sometimes the end justifies the means.

Nab
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Re: Campbell has to go..

Post by almac »

a few thoughts:

IMHO. my prediction is that james will get in by a landslide. people here are *bleep*.

In office she will flounder around and try to fix all the economic damage left over from the liberals; the costs of the olympics alone will be enough to bury any party in power when the 'final bill' gets released to BC, and taxpayers will be left holding the bag.
not being able to really repair anything, the people will get *bleep*, and the libs will return in 4 years. the NDP will leave the elections race with a 10+ year scar. heads held in shame.

not to go off topic, but i frequently wonder if in the USA republican party 'engineered' their loss, so the 'other guy' had to deal with the economic crisis. this way after all the smoke has cleared, and the democrats fail to fix the depression, the republicans will return as heros when the economic crisis is near its' end.

this makes me wonder as to weather we should vote for the libs again(no im anti liberal). they will get in, and with the state of the economy, and thier inability to fix it, they will be smeared so bad the liberal party will be dissolved. (just a thought) mabye cambell should be there when the bills are reported to the people, then the people will finally see the truth instead of blaming the other guy.
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al

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