Sick of NDP attack ads

BC's provincial election and STV referendum takes place Tuesday May 12th.
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usquebaugh
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

Post by usquebaugh »

logicalview wrote:
Al Czervic wrote: I honestly think (and expected) that the “new” NDP could have and should have done better.


Nobody wants to take a foul mouth bride dressed as a hooker to the alter.

Now if they could assemble a platform to benefit British Columbians and earn their vote then we would have a horse race.


That's nice. I'd rather go to the altar with Carole James and the NDP, than see the province's natural resources prostituted and raped by Gordon Campbell and the Liberals.

I also think that freezing the tuition will benefit British Columbians, as lifting the tuition freeze made it harder for people to earn a post-secondary education (especially single parents, who had to choose between tuition and providing food and shelter for their children when the Liberals lifted the tuition freeze).
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steven lloyd
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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logicalview wrote: Here's the FIRST page of the NDP's platform document after the Table of Contents....

It’s time to end eight years of Gordon Campbell’s arrogance and neglect


It’s time to Take Back Your BC.

On May 12, British Columbians will choose between two very different futures for our province.
Gordon Campbell is making life harder and less affordable for working families. He’s increasing taxes
and cutting the services you depend on.
Gordon Campbell’s plan:
• Increases taxes for average families by tripling the gas tax. And Campbell’s top advisor says it has to
increase to 24 cents on every litre of gas.
• Breaks his promise to build 5,000 long-term care beds and improve care for seniors.
• Cuts the budget for community safety, including courts, prosecutors and corrections.
• Continues the sell-off of BC’s lands, rivers and streams to private interests.
• Promotes offshore oil and gas and other environmentally-destructive practices.
With BC’s economy hurting, Gordon Campbell can’t be trusted to protect you in tough times. And if he’s elected he will use the recession to slash vital public services even further and increase your taxes.


More platform - less ego please.


Here's what you find when you read more:

A B.C. New Democratic Party government would scrap the carbon tax, give small businesses a one-year “tax holiday”, raise the minimum wage to $10 an hour and freeze post-secondary tuition fees.

The measures are included in a 46-page election platform document NDP leader Carole James released in Burnaby this morning.

The platform also promises smaller classes, more police, more prosecutors, greater environmental protection, 3,000 new long-term care beds for seniors, reduced transit fares and more accountability at B.C. Ferries. There would be more money for housing, park programming, women's centres, anti-violence programs, the arts and tourism.

An accompanying 10-page appendix on “strategic investments” says implementing the NDP platform would add a “modest and affordable” $1.465 billion in debt this year to what the Liberal government has already projected, and $1.557 billion in 2010-2011.

The platform promises reduced deficits and a balanced budget in the fourth year of the plan.



p.s you're supporting Campbell and complaining about ego ? :dyinglaughing: :dyinglaughing:
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usquebaugh
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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steven lloyd wrote:p.s you're supporting Campbell and complaining about ego ? :dyinglaughing: :dyinglaughing:


Hey, now... don't make coffee come shooting out of my nose please! :coffeecanuck:
Where oh where’d my body go?
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Where or where’d my body go?
Where’d my body go?
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steven lloyd
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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usquebaugh wrote: I also think that freezing the tuition will benefit British Columbians, as lifting the tuition freeze made it harder for people to earn a post-secondary education



But that's how you ensure that only the priviledged will get an advance education, thereby ensuring the perpetuation of the income gap. It's important that we have executives who make $10,000,000 a year - even if thousands have to live on the street and lower-middle class workers have to go to foodbanks to supplement their grocery needs to accomplish that.
Last edited by steven lloyd on Apr 10th, 2009, 10:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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steven lloyd wrote:
usquebaugh wrote: I also think that freezing the tuition will benefit British Columbians, as lifting the tuition freeze made it harder for people to earn a post-secondary education



But that's how you ensure that only the priviledged will get an advance education, thereby ensuring the perpetuation of the income gap. It's important that we have executives who make $10,000,000 a year - even if thousands have to live on the street to accomplish that.


I know. I remember Campbell saying that people who wanted better paying jobs should get an education, even as he made the means for doing so that much harder for those less privileged than his friends... There's a reason that bile forms in the back of my throat when I think of that man, as I watched people I did my undergraduate degree have to drop out or else scale back the number of classes they were taking (thus, pushing back their graduation date) when the tuition freeze was lifted.
Where oh where’d my body go?
Africa or Mexico?
Where or where’d my body go?
Where’d my body go?
Have you seen my ghost?
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

Post by logicalview »

usquebaugh wrote:That's nice. I'd rather go to the altar with Carole James and the NDP, than see the province's natural resources prostituted and raped by Gordon Campbell and the Liberals.


Get a ring and a date. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

As far as "prostitution" of our natural resources goes, there are thousands of families that feed the mouths of their childern by working in forestry, mining and other resource based industries that disagree with you. There are further thousands that live off of government handouts that benefit from the taxes generated by these industries.

Hey, maybe your right, let's put an abrupt end to our resource based economy, save the environment - starve the people.

And from their hard work they pay taxes so that others may have the benefit of a post secondary education. Then there are those who are fortunate to take advantage of the system and think that it is their god given right not to have to contribute to it.
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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usquebaugh wrote:There's a reason that bile forms in the back of my throat when I think of that man, as I watched people I did my undergraduate degree have to drop out or else scale back the number of classes they were taking (thus, pushing back their graduation date) when the tuition freeze was lifted.


Just another hard done by spoilt left winger.

Take take, complain whine *bleep* that more more more is owed to them personally.
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usquebaugh
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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logicalview wrote:
usquebaugh wrote:There's a reason that bile forms in the back of my throat when I think of that man, as I watched people I did my undergraduate degree have to drop out or else scale back the number of classes they were taking (thus, pushing back their graduation date) when the tuition freeze was lifted.


Just another hard done by spoilt left winger.

Take take, complain whine *bleep* that more more more is owed to them personally.


Actually, I'm not one of those who needed to worry about the tuition freeze, because I have gone through my post-secondary education (undergraduate and graduate) while fully funded, but there are those who were trying to get an education for whom it was made very difficult.

It's nice to know that you enjoy spitting on them.
Where oh where’d my body go?
Africa or Mexico?
Where or where’d my body go?
Where’d my body go?
Have you seen my ghost?
Staring at the ground?
Have you seen my ghost?
Sick of those *bleep* clouds
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steven lloyd
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

Post by steven lloyd »

logicalview wrote: ..., there are thousands of families that feed the mouths of their childern by working in forestry, mining and other resource based industries that disagree with you. There are further thousands that live off of government handouts that benefit from the taxes generated by these industries. Hey, maybe your right, let's put an abrupt end to our resource based economy, save the environment - starve the people.


And you assume all this resource development would just stop under the NDP. That's so illogical.

Perhaps less money being made would be leaving the province, but heh, that's just me. I don't owe any friends on Howe, Bay or Wall Street.

By the way, the children of these families working reseource based communities rarely go on to university. They can't afford it.
Last edited by steven lloyd on Apr 10th, 2009, 10:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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usquebaugh
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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logicalview wrote:
usquebaugh wrote:That's nice. I'd rather go to the altar with Carole James and the NDP, than see the province's natural resources prostituted and raped by Gordon Campbell and the Liberals.


Get a ring and a date. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

As far as "prostitution" of our natural resources goes, there are thousands of families that feed the mouths of their childern by working in forestry, mining and other resource based industries that disagree with you. There are further thousands that live off of government handouts that benefit from the taxes generated by these industries.

Hey, maybe your right, let's put an abrupt end to our resource based economy, save the environment - starve the people.

And from their hard work they pay taxes so that others may have the benefit of a post secondary education. Then there are those who are fortunate to take advantage of the system and think that it is their god given right not to have to contribute to it.


Did I say anything about shutting down the forestry industry or any other industry? No, you're constantly trying to twist what I've said. But I don't think that privatizing and deregulating have done anything to help all the thousands of British Columbians who are out of work in our resource based economy, while El Gordo's corporate friends feast off the spoils... Ask the children of all those who have been laid off how they're doing under this provincial government, and why the government doesn't seem to care about helping those in rural communities, so much as it cares about its base in the lower mainland.
Where oh where’d my body go?
Africa or Mexico?
Where or where’d my body go?
Where’d my body go?
Have you seen my ghost?
Staring at the ground?
Have you seen my ghost?
Sick of those *bleep* clouds
Al Czervic
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

Post by Al Czervic »

steven lloyd wrote:
Al Czervic wrote:
steven lloyd wrote:
logicalview wrote: Now if they could assemble a platform to benefit British Columbians and earn their vote then we would have a horse race.


http://www.bcndp.ca/newsroom/ndp-platfo ... ucation-an

http://thetyee.ca/Blogs/TheHook/Electio ... mPlatform/

http://www.bcndp.ca/category/carole-spe ... l-election



I have read all of those links and the entire NDP platform. Even a first year economics or business student can see the very serious flaws in the NDP platform. I will be posting more on this later.


I look forward to it Al. I'd appreciate some thoughtful and intelligent feedback.


First off; I do commend the NDP for indicating where they would like to spend more money. On the same theme; I think we all know that spending money is the easy part; the hard part is where does the money come from? This is where I have deep concerns with the NDP platform.

If I would have thought the NDP learned anything from the 1990’s; I would have thought they would have learned that you cannot relentlessly tax industry and not expect there to be serious economic repercussions. As I have said many times over the years; Companies (especially mining companies) didn’t leave Canada; only BC. When industry companies leave BC; so too do hi-paying jobs.

This takes me back to the NDP platform. The NDP expects to tax the oil & gas industry to the tune of nearly half a BILLION dollars to pay for part of the increased NDP spending platform. The problem when you tax any industry to that extent is that you end up loosing the investment and the tax revenue never materializes. This leaves you with a problem. Do you still spend that money and add massive debt ? or do you cut expenditures ? It is a very serious problem.

When you consider that BC Personal income taxes collected; all PST taxes collected; and all MSP Premiums paid combined cannot even fund the healthcare budget for one year you begin to understand why we cannot afford to loose the Oil & Gas sector that has only recently been re-energized.

Excessive NDP taxation killed the mining industry in the 1990’s and it will kill the oil & sector today. This is only but one of many concerns that I have with the NDP platform.
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steven lloyd
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

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Al Czervic wrote: The NDP expects to tax the oil & gas industry to the tune of nearly half a BILLION dollars to pay for part of the increased NDP spending platform. The problem when you tax any industry to that extent is that you end up loosing the investment and the tax revenue never materializes. This leaves you with a problem. Do you still spend that money and add massive debt ? or do you cut expenditures ? It is a very serious problem.


That is a problem. Got to get to some errands now bit I expect there is going to be a lot of good (and a loy of ridiculous) stuff posted on these threads for me to read when I get the next chance. Cheers.
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

Post by logicalview »

usquebaugh wrote:Actually, I'm not one of those who needed to worry about the tuition freeze, because I have gone through my post-secondary education (undergraduate and graduate) while fully funded, but there are those who were trying to get an education for whom it was made very difficult.

It's nice to know that you enjoy spitting on them.



Spitting on them? Enjoy spitting on them?

You my dear a a very angry young lady.
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Al Czervic
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

Post by Al Czervic »

steven lloyd wrote:
Al Czervic wrote:
steven lloyd wrote:
logicalview wrote: Now if they could assemble a platform to benefit British Columbians and earn their vote then we would have a horse race.


http://www.bcndp.ca/newsroom/ndp-platfo ... ucation-an

http://thetyee.ca/Blogs/TheHook/Electio ... mPlatform/

http://www.bcndp.ca/category/carole-spe ... l-election



I have read all of those links and the entire NDP platform. Even a first year economics or business student can see the very serious flaws in the NDP platform. I will be posting more on this later.


I look forward to it Al. I'd appreciate some thoughtful and intelligent feedback.


Another concern I have is that in order for the NDP Platform numbers to work; they need to cut $ 1.3 BILLION in government spending. Now keep in mind the BC Liberals have already enacted about $ 2 BILLION in savings through reduced travel; advertising and contracting out. I think we can all agree that when it comes to “cutting” things the BC Liberals have proven fairly capable of that.

Now the NDP are suggesting they can cut a FURTHER $ 1.3 BILLION and they cite some examples. Yes; they can definitely roll back those excessive bureaucrat pay raises given out last summer but that only amounts to a saving of $ 4 million. Conversely even though they have only promised to reduce the Public Affairs Bureau; even if they eliminated it all together that is only a saving of $ 28 MILLION. So far we have saving of $ 32 MILLION. So we still have over $ I BILLION more to go.

The NDP have not stated anywhere with this added BILLION in reduced spending would come from. We can only assume it they would have to cancel existing spending commitments or announcements; yet there is no list of what those cuts would be. I have a hard time with a spare BILLION not being accounted for.

And let’s face it; unless you are Campbell; cuts are not easy to do. People don’t like cuts. Carole James has been a demonstrated flip flopper who has never once shown any backbone on anything. Thus if she is unable to carry through on cutting that BILLION dollars in government spending it becomes yet another BILLION in debt. Given the NDP’s history with adding debt you can understand my concern….
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Re: Sick of NDP attack ads

Post by Al Czervic »

steven lloyd wrote:
Al Czervic wrote:
steven lloyd wrote:
logicalview wrote: Now if they could assemble a platform to benefit British Columbians and earn their vote then we would have a horse race.


http://www.bcndp.ca/newsroom/ndp-platfo ... ucation-an

http://thetyee.ca/Blogs/TheHook/Electio ... mPlatform/

http://www.bcndp.ca/category/carole-spe ... l-election



I have read all of those links and the entire NDP platform. Even a first year economics or business student can see the very serious flaws in the NDP platform. I will be posting more on this later.


I look forward to it Al. I'd appreciate some thoughtful and intelligent feedback.


Another concerns I have; and just to typify the flaws in the NDP Platform is that they are promising to add $ 75 MILLION in higher water rental rights for water license holders.

For those of you not in the know; water rental rates are basically the crown royalties that are collected from those with a water license. The majority of BC’s water license holders are IPP Run of the River projects. Now keep in mind that in spite of what that NDP will tell you; what they and super liar Rafe Mair will not tell you is the fact that the NDP actually got more IPP Run of the River projects up and running in this Province than the BC Liberals ever have. That’s right the NDP actually created more IPP Run of the river Projects than the BC Liberals have. Funny how Rafe Mair and the NDP try to hide that fact.

So the NDP can raise these costs all they want; the IPP’s can simply apply to the BC Utilities Commission and these costs get directly downloaded to consumers. So you end up taking money form the very people you are supposedly trying to protect. This policy makes no sense and I amazed they would even include it in the platform.
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