South Carolina and the GOP

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Grand Pooh-bah
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South Carolina and the GOP

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Help me, I admit there's an awful lot I don't understand about U.S. politics and esp. the dynamics and the appeal of the Republican Party nowadays. But I was born and raised in a so-called evangelical Christian family and church culture with continuing links (I myself am "former" in that culture) and I know what flies, or used to. So South Carolina, with almost half of its voters identifying themselves as evangelical Christians, has almost overwhelmingly endorsed Newt Gingrich for the GOP candidate for president. He having been disgraced in the 1990s for corruption as a congressman; he having been outed by his former wife as a philandering liar.

When I was growing up, my parents and their friends didn't vote because of the Biblical injunction, "Be ye in the world but not of it." That applied to a lot of evangelical Christians at that time, but it has largely broken down as I understand it. Now the evangelicals participate in the democratic process, as they probably should, but at what cost to their supposed integrity. What cynicism has taken hold that South Carolina's Christians would forgive Gingrich so many sins.

I've long since come to the realization that there was a big disconnect between Christians' beliefs and business practices, so I'm not surprised they've forgiven Newt his 1990s disgraces in his former House Speaker role; but not the sorts of things this good old boy (Newt) did with his wife (wives) over the years. And these the so-called "family values" voters of the U.S. Welcome to worldly politics. Enjoy.
wthwyt
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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I pay no attention to US elect until the Tuesday after the first Monday in November (even then big whoop), 10+ months of over priced BS.
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Glacier
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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There seems to be a strong "anybody but Romney" sentiment down there, so it doesn't matter what the person believes or stands for; whomever is believed to have the best chance of beating Romney gets a lot of support. In the case of the South Carolina vote, it just so happens to be that the least Christian of all the candidates was deemed to be that man.

The GOP race is probably the strangest political race in U.S. history. Practically everyone has risen to the top of the pack at one point in the race - and they've only just started the primaries. First where was Michelle Bachmann who peaked far too early, then there was Herman Cain with personal problems, then there was Rick Perry who had mind blanking problems, then there was Ron Paul who was too libertarian, then there was Rick Santorum who is too religious, then there was Romney was too cozy with big business, then there was Newt Gingrich who wasn't Romney.
Last edited by Glacier on Jan 22nd, 2012, 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Urbane
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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It all adds up to good news for President Obama. Romney will still likely be the nominee but what with (some of) his past business dealings, his Cayman Island accounts (not necessarily anything wrong with them but . . .), his flip-flopping on the issues, his establishment of "Romney Care" in Massachussetts (much the same as "Obama Care"), and the fact that he's Mormon he's going to have a tough road ahead. One would hope that his religion wouldn't be an issue but it is for some who consider Mormonism a type of cult.

The conventional wisdom has been that if the economy improves Obama will win and if it doesn't his Republican opponent will win. I think the former is definitely true but given the lightweight Republican field Obama could still win even if the economy doesn't improve.
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steven lloyd
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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Urbane wrote:It all adds up to good news for President Obama. ... The conventional wisdom has been that if the economy improves Obama will win and if it doesn't his Republican opponent will win. I think the former is definitely true but given the lightweight Republican field Obama could still win even if the economy doesn't improve.

The Republican Presidential candidate race has been the greatest singular event to help support Obama's bid for re-election.
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Grand Pooh-bah
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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Within the conservative house there are, to be simplistic, hard-drinking, immoral, unfaithful, womanizing conservatives, and there are evangelical Christian conservatives. I don't understand how the latter can embrace the former under any circumstances, even if the alternative is a Mormon. Gingrich said his second wife wasn't young enough or pretty enough to be First Lady. Gingrich asked his second wife for an open marriage so he could carry on with his House assistant. And he supposedly asked her while she was recovering from a cancer operation. What a vile individual, even before we get into his corruption history. Romney is apparently going to hammer Gingrich on "character" going into the Florida primary on Jan. 31. Wow. Let's call it the COP for Corrupt Old Party. I don't understand how it remains a contender in the U.S. with its narrow ideological, economic and racial base. The Democrats are conservative enough.
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Captain Awesome
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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Obama won't survive. Republicans can get a *bleep* half-blind donkey to run against him and win.
Sarcasm is like a good game of chess. Most people don't know how to play chess.
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Urbane
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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    Captain Awesome wrote:Obama won't survive. Republicans can get a *bleep* half-blind donkey to run against him and win.
More often than not the incumbent President wins and don't be fooled by the relatively low approval ratings. Many are saying that they don't approve of Obama's performance but they're still planning on voting for him over the Republican candidate. Add in the fact that Obama is a great campaigner and I'd say the odds are in his favour.
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Homeownertoo
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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I agree Romney will be chosen in the end, and this bruising primary campaign has the virtue, for him, of getting his negatives out early rather than in the midst of the presidential campaign.

As for the mystery of the tarnished Gingrich's success in S.C., if you saw his rebuttal at the start of the Thursday debates, you would be less puzzled. It was the kind of masterful putdown of the media that evangelicals and tea partiers have been long thirsting for. And regarding his record in Congress, its dismal conclusion was hardly reflective of his performance overall. His restoration of Republican supremacy there will not be soon forgotten.
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Glacier
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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It's abundantly clear that there are some major divisions among the republican party.
  • Romney represents the business wing,
  • Paul represents the libertarian wing,
  • Santorum represents the religious wing, and
  • Gingrich represents the criminal wing of the party.
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Urbane
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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    Glacier wrote:It's abundantly clear that there are some major divisions among the republican party.
    • Romney represents the business wing,
    • Paul represents the libertarian wing,
    • Santorum represents the religious wing, and
    • Gingrich represents the criminal wing of the party.
Funny and not altogether off the mark either. The thing about Gingrich that always stuck in my mind was him cheating on his former wife, with his present wife, at the same time he was leading the impeachment movement against President Clinton. I realize there was more to the case against Clinton than just infidelity but I just found that situation ironic.
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Grand Pooh-bah
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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Newt Gingrich is an amoral, vile individual. Georgia gave him its delegates the other day on Super Tuesday. I don't understand the southern evangelicals and fundamentalists, as I noted to start this thread. What hypocrisy. Although I can think of another fine-line walking such from our own midst: Rev. Phil Gaglardi, our once-upon-a-time swashbuckling Minister of Highways.
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Urbane
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Re: South Carolina and the GOP

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    occasional thoughts wrote:Newt Gingrich is an amoral, vile individual. Georgia gave him its delegates the other day on Super Tuesday. I don't understand the southern evangelicals and fundamentalists, as I noted to start this thread. What hypocrisy. Although I can think of another fine-line walking such from our own midst: Rev. Phil Gaglardi, our once-upon-a-time swashbuckling Minister of Highways.
In 1968 there had been charges that Gaglardi had taken his daughter on a government jet but when WAC Bennett confronted him he denied the charge. Premier Bennett later found out that it was Gaglardi's daughter-in-law who had been on the jet but Gaglardi hadn't shared that fact with Bennett. So Bennett booted him out of cabinet. I heard WAC Bennett tell that story in an interview after he was out of office.

As for the GOP Romney will undoubtedly be the nominee and it'll be a horse race in November. As of today Romney polls about 5 points ahead of Obama in the Rasmussen poll but if I had to bet I'd say Obama will win in a squeaker. But it could easily go either way depending on the economy.

ETA: I see that several other polls put Obama ahead of Romney so the Rasmussen poll is the odd man out at the moment.

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