Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Ingevan22
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Joined: Nov 8th, 2011, 12:04 pm

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by Ingevan22 »

Scott, thanks for taking the time to post more of your views, I'm hopeful that you will be elected to Council as part of a fiscally responsible team that truly understands and commits to their obligations to our taxpayers.

In terms of regional collaboration, you have hit the nail on the head. RDNO's member jurisdictions cannot come to the regional board table solely to represent their own municipal or electoral area interests, they must at the same time consider the best interests of the region, and move forward together. It is a difficult task, and one that doesn't come easily or naturally for most elected officials.

A Mayor for Vernon with a vision, who is an effective leader and who understands the important role our city plays as the largest municipal partner in the regional district, can inspire and facilitate regional collaboration.

In response to the comment that those running for Mayor should have experience, I was disheartened to read on one candidate's website that he has "not spent countless hours as a council member or on a board of some sort." Does that mean he views sitting on a council or a board as a waste of time, or am I reading that wrong?
ScottSA
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Joined: Feb 1st, 2009, 9:22 am

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by ScottSA »

Ingevan22 wrote:Scott, thanks for taking the time to post more of your views, I'm hopeful that you will be elected to Council as part of a fiscally responsible team that truly understands and commits to their obligations to our taxpayers.


Thanks for your support!

It's (1) fiscal responsibility and (2) actively promoting more citizen participation that I'm interested in above all. I assume that most people understand the need for taxes, but at the same time want responsible decisions to be made with them. I also assume that most people want as little to do with City hall as possible, but at the same time feel that they have a right to be heard when City Halls is taking action that affects them.

On another topic entirely, I just took a look at Vernonblog, and it has some good advice about municipal voting:

When you vote for Council you do not have to pick 6. If you only have 3 candidates you are comfortable with then just vote for 3. Adding names for the sake of filling out your dance card is like voting against your first choices.

It also has a straw poll, for anyone interested in chipping in: http://www.okanaganpolls.ca/vernon-elections-2011.asp
ScottSA
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Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by ScottSA »

Image

NEWS RELEASE
NRCC- 005 11 November, 2011

ONLY TWO VERNON CANDIDATES SIGN CONTRACT WITH TAXPAYERS

VERNON— Scott Anderson, currently running for Vernon City Council, is one of only two Vernon candidates to sign the Canadian Taxpayer's Federation (CTF) pledge to introduce a Taxpayer Protection Bylaw in their community.

The bylaw would enshrine the Contract’s principles and enforce a provision for a 15% pay cut for both the mayor and council if property taxes are raised beyond the rate of inflation without explicit public consent.

"Everyone talks about fiscal responsibility at election time," said Scott Anderson, candidate for Vernon City Council. "But this is the one chance candidates have to put their money where their mouth is. As it turns out, Bob Spiers and I are the only ones with the guts to do it."



The Contract with Taxpayers includes ten points, including keeping tax increases at or below the provincial rate of inflation, encouraging direct democracy, supporting transparency in expenses and a Municipal Auditor General, and combating senior levels of government when they try to download services onto the municipality.

“This commitment to taxpayers is unprecedented in its strength and diligence,” said Jordan Bateman, the CTF’s British Columbia director. “These candidates aren’t just talking the talk, they are walking the walk—putting their own salaries on the line to keep property taxes as low as possible.”

If elected, Anderson plans to call for more communication from City Hall, help bring fiscal sanity to city council, repair existing infrastructure, support a Core Services Review, and help create a business friendly environment in Vernon.

For more information:

Scott Anderson, Candidate, Vernon City Council

-----------------------------------

BACKGROUNDER
NCCCTF-05

Text: Contract with Taxpayers

If elected as a mayor or councillor on November 19, I pledge to uphold these principles:

I will not vote to raise property taxes beyond the provincial rate of inflation (unless I get approval from taxpayers in a referendum)—and will diligently try to get increases lower than that.

I will move our municipality toward fee for service for as many functions as possible.

I will not vote to take on or fund services that are the proper jurisdiction of federal, provincial or regional governments.

I will push my municipality to investigate partnerships with other governments, non-profit organizations and businesses to reduce costs of service delivery. Infrastructure and public safety will be my top budgetary priorities. Taxpayers’ personal property rights will be respected and upheld. Under my watch, citizens will receive complete, accurate and timely information from their municipal government.

I will ensure taxpayers have the opportunity to participate in open dialogue with the mayor and council, voicing their opinions on any matter affecting the municipality.

I will publicly disclose and publish copies of all receipts I charge to my municipal expense account.

I will support measures that improve transparency and accountability, such as a Municipal Auditor General, introduction of municipal politician recall rules, and the use of referenda, plebiscites and citizen initiatives to gauge public opinion on major expenditures and issues.

I will support the introduction of a Taxpayer Protection Bylaw (similar to the one attached) that financially punishes any mayor and council for raising taxes above the rate of inflation with a one year, 15% pay cut.
JohnD
Posts: 9
Joined: Dec 3rd, 2007, 8:35 pm

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by JohnD »

Hi Scott,

In a previous post, you asked this question regarding the construction timeline pertaining to proposed changes to 43rd:

I question your assertion that it won't involve months of construction. In every other case it takes months on end; why would it take less time on 43 Avenue?

I made one phonecall to the City and received this report:

http://freepdfhosting.com/02561d65f7.pdf

It shows how a "road diet" works, what the changes to 43rd would look like and why. On page 28, it also spells out the timeline, very clearly. If the grant is successful, and the costs of paving are covered, then we are looking at 2 weeks. If the costs of paving are not covered, then painting lines will take around 2 days. This is also noted on page 16.

This is not an infrastructure improvement project. Curbs will not be moved. This is a simple deal, and can easily be converted back should traffic volumes greatly increase.

This information was easy to get. Why don't you have it?
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coffeeFreak
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Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by coffeeFreak »

JohnD wrote:Hi Scott,

In a previous post, you asked this question regarding the construction timeline pertaining to proposed changes to 43rd:

I question your assertion that it won't involve months of construction. In every other case it takes months on end; why would it take less time on 43 Avenue?

I made one phonecall to the City and received this report:

http://freepdfhosting.com/02561d65f7.pdf

It shows how a "road diet" works, what the changes to 43rd would look like and why. On page 28, it also spells out the timeline, very clearly. If the grant is successful, and the costs of paving are covered, then we are looking at 2 weeks. If the costs of paving are not covered, then painting lines will take around 2 days. This is also noted on page 16.

This is not an infrastructure improvement project. Curbs will not be moved. This is a simple deal, and can easily be converted back should traffic volumes greatly increase.

This information was easy to get. Why don't you have it?


I'm not sure what your point is here JohnD, but a nice shiny pdf put out by the city of Vernon can hardly be taken as "credible", given their track record for project pictures before and project realities after.
JohnD
Posts: 9
Joined: Dec 3rd, 2007, 8:35 pm

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by JohnD »

This has nothing to do with pretty pictures. It has everything to do with a timeline that Scott had said would take months. Here is a report that says 2 days to 2 weeks, depending on the funding received and whether paving will be done or not.

I think this is a whole lot more credible than the fearmongering from a politician in training!
ScottSA
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Posts: 104
Joined: Feb 1st, 2009, 9:22 am

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by ScottSA »

JohnD wrote:This has nothing to do with pretty pictures. It has everything to do with a timeline that Scott had said would take months. Here is a report that says 2 days to 2 weeks, depending on the funding received and whether paving will be done or not.

I think this is a whole lot more credible than the fearmongering from a politician in training!
I'm not sure why you're so angry, but the road diet PDF you have access to is for painting stripes on the road. Granted I used "road diet" as a short form, like everyone else, to describe the construction project, but I assure you the development plan is for a good deal more than painting stripes on the road. I'll be happy to dig it up for you and show you if you want. Yes I know the City has every reason to minimize the 43rd Ave project, but presenting line painting as representative of the real project is like presenting a PDF of how to paint a house and claiming that's all there is to building one.

Surely you don't believe the construction project will take two weeks? Two days? You've seen the road diet construction on Allenby, 20th, and 29th, right? It's not measured in days or weeks; it's measured in months. The construction project downtown just announced another several weeks of delay too. I'm afraid you've been misled.
JohnD
Posts: 9
Joined: Dec 3rd, 2007, 8:35 pm

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by JohnD »

I'm not angry at all, in fact I've had a wonderful day!

What I can't figure out is why you keep bringing up 20th, 29th, and Allenby. Those projects were infrastructure upgrades that had redevelopments piggybacked with the projects. Infrastructure upgrades like water, sewer, etc. took place. When you make those sorts of improvements, yes things are going to take quite some time to finish. The turning circle on PV was the same sort of upgrade and piggyback. 43rd is not an infrastructure upgrade.

Go find out for yourself. Walk up and down the halls and ask.
ScottSA
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Joined: Feb 1st, 2009, 9:22 am

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by ScottSA »

JohnD wrote:I'm not angry at all, in fact I've had a wonderful day!

What I can't figure out is why you keep bringing up 20th, 29th, and Allenby. Those projects were infrastructure upgrades that had redevelopments piggybacked with the projects. Infrastructure upgrades like water, sewer, etc. took place. When you make those sorts of improvements, yes things are going to take quite some time to finish. The turning circle on PV was the same sort of upgrade and piggyback. 43rd is not an infrastructure upgrade.

Go find out for yourself. Walk up and down the halls and ask.

Great to hear you had a wonderful day! Just to clarify, I'm not a "politician in training" - I've been involved in politics at the federal level for years, including two stints as a federal campaign manager and a term in Ottawa.

Does the following page give you some pause?

Options for the reallocated road space
• Wider sidewalks / pavement cafes
• Curb extensions / bulbs
• Centre medians
• Landscaping boulevards
• Street trees
• On-street parking (parallel or angled)
On 43rd Avenue it is a re painting of lane lines
only, no other changes would be included.


Notice the contradictions here? "No other changes would be included" - except that the proposal clearly shows other changes (existing vs proposed). If the project is simply a matter of painting stripes on the road, where is all the extra space going to come from? How does eliminating half a lane (which is what will be left after the bike path is in) suddenly allow for angled parking (at least a lane and a half)?

The PDF is intentionally mixing up concepts; on the one hand arguing that it's nothing at all, and on the other admitting that it's lots. The proposal under consideration involves some of the changes mentioned above - or to be pedantic, some of the changes above are included in the proposed blueprints. I suggest to you that when the rubber hits the road on this thing, there will be all sorts of piggybacks on it.
JohnD
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Joined: Dec 3rd, 2007, 8:35 pm

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by JohnD »

As a potential representative to the community, I suggest you do your due diligence and go in and challenge them. Ask! If you are elected, you will have to work with these people, and do this very same thing when digging up information on one project or another. If you are right, you will have proven your point. If you are wrong....well....then I guess you learned something you didn't know before.

I did it, you can too!
ScottSA
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Posts: 104
Joined: Feb 1st, 2009, 9:22 am

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by ScottSA »

JohnD wrote:As a potential representative to the community, I suggest you do your due diligence and go in and challenge them. Ask! If you are elected, you will have to work with these people, and do this very same thing when digging up information on one project or another. If you are right, you will have proven your point. If you are wrong....well....then I guess you learned something you didn't know before.

I did it, you can too!
Thanks for the advice.

NEW BUSINESS 43RD AVENUE ROAD http://www.vernon.ca/images/uploads/council/minutes/110613_cow.pdf
DIET AND ACCIDENT REDUCTION PROJECT
(5410-10)
Council reviewed and discussed the report dated June 3, 2011, from the Transportation Technician, regarding the 43rd Avenue Road diet and accident reduction project.
Council requested clarification on the submitted capital SLA for 2010
regarding the 43rd Avenue Road diet – and how the costs being considered now are different. Confirmation that all the works would be completed with the grant monies, and that there are no additional costs anticipated.
Councillor O’Keefe left the meeting at 9:11 am.
Councillor O’Keefe returned to the meeting at 9:12 am.
Moved by Councillor O’Keefe, seconded by Councillor Gilroy:
THAT Council instructs staff, that subject to successful award of the 100 percent $868,000 Gas Tax Innovation Fund grant, to proceed with the implementation of the Road Diet on 43rd Avenue between 27th and 32nd Streets.
QUESTIONED CALLED ON THE MOTION AND DECLARED CARRIED, with Councillor Spiers opposed.


5. NEW BUSINESShttp://www.vernon.ca/images/uploads/council/agendas/packages/110613.pdf
A. THAT Council instruct staff, subject to successful award of the 100 percent $868,000 Gas Tax lnnovation Fund grant, to
proceed with the implementation of the Road Diet in 43rd Avenue between 27t^ and 32nd Streets; AND FURTHER that this work in 43'd Avenue include Accident Reduction measures at the intersection of 31tt Street, once the Polson Greenway Phase 2,2011 capital project in 29th Street is completed.

I think it's worth mentioning that contrary to Mayor Lippert's claim, City Council has actually already passed the road diet - see red font.
ScottSA
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Joined: Feb 1st, 2009, 9:22 am

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by ScottSA »

John, thanks for your note on Facebook, but the fact is that I'm not anti-bike at all. I'm not sure why you see it that way. I actually ride my bike all summer long whenever I have time. I'm against the 43rd Avenue road project specifically, and I'm against it only because the people whose life savings are invested in businesses on that road are against it. It seems to me to be only fair that their needs outweigh our wants as cyclists.

Claiming I'm anti-bike on the strength of that is like claiming I'm against cars because I don't want the soccer fields on the landing paved over.
JohnD
Posts: 9
Joined: Dec 3rd, 2007, 8:35 pm

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by JohnD »

Hi Scott,

Once again, if you had asked someone for the information, you would have received it. But don't worry, I went ahead and did it!

From council meeting on October 11, 2011

CORRESPONDENCE:43rd AVENUE ROAD DIET AND ACCIDENT REDUCTION PROJECT– RESULTS OF INPUT SESSION ANDSUBSEQUENT INPUTAmanda Watson, Municipal Transportation Tech III, reviewed the historyand background information related to the proposed 43rd Avenue RoadDiet and Accident Reduction Project.Moved by Councillor O’Keefe, seconded by Councillor Lee:THAT Council, defers further consideration of the proposed ‘43rdAvenue Road Diet and Accident Reduction Project’, and directs staffto provide a report back for consideration during the 2012 Budgetmeetings that provides the following information:PAGE 12 REGULAR OPEN MEETING OF COUNCIL TUESDAY, OCTOBER 11, 20111. How will the proposed project impact the number of vehiclestravelling on 43rd Avenue?2. What will the impact be on the two left hand turn lanes, that arecurrently close together, and how is the current situation goingto be improved by this project?3. What is the timeline for of the 48th Avenue Extension, andshould the 43rd avenue project be done after Completion?4. Provide confirmation of the impact to businesses, includingcomparatives, local examples, and safety issues.CARRIED, with Councillors Nicol and Gilroy opposed.

Or you can go to pages 11-12 here : http://www.vernon.ca/images/uploads/cou ... 111011.pdf

Regarding my private Facebook message to you, I have to take exception that you would make reference to it in a public forum. Since you have deemed it neccesary to share this, why don't we clarify it, completely.

I responded to an unsolicited Facebook friendship request from a local politician...that being yourself. I declined your request and sent you a PRIVATE message stating why I have chosen not to vote for you. That message reads as such:

Sorry Scott, but your anti bike/ bike lane stance in this election means I can't vote for you. And I'm not the only voting cyclist who thinks this way. Good luck!

I did not randomly send you a message, I merely responded to contact that you initiated.

Why you have chosen to make reference to this private message in a public forum not only crosses ethical boundaries, it's also disturbing. What other private messages are you willing to share when someone has a viewpoint other than yours? What are your limits? How can you be trusted with any kind of private information? Who is next?
ScottSA
Fledgling
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Joined: Feb 1st, 2009, 9:22 am

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by ScottSA »

Regarding my private Facebook message to you, I have to take exception that you would make reference to it in a public forum. Since you have deemed it neccesary to share this, why don't we clarify it, completely.

I responded to an unsolicited Facebook friendship request from a local politician...that being yourself. I declined your request and sent you a PRIVATE message stating why I have chosen not to vote for you. That message reads as such:

Sorry Scott, but your anti bike/ bike lane stance in this election means I can't vote for you. And I'm not the only voting cyclist who thinks this way. Good luck!

I did not randomly send you a message, I merely responded to contact that you initiated.

Why you have chosen to make reference to this private message in a public forum not only crosses ethical boundaries, it's also disturbing. What other private messages are you willing to share when someone has a viewpoint other than yours? What are your limits? How can you be trusted with any kind of private information? Who is next?


My apologies if your message was in response to my request - I was told by another party, not knowing of the conversation here - that you might be someone interested. I made several requests of people and didn't make the connection between you here and you there until after you messaged me. Had I known that you were responding to my request I wouldn't have brought it up here - and I did try first to reply, but as you know, you reported me as spam so I couldn't. Again I apologize.

Having said that, "John" is hardly a giveaway of your name or who you are, since it's your username, so I think trying to make it an ethical concern is a bit hyperbolic, don't you? It's not as if everyone here didn't already know that "John" disagrees with me.

However, I'm still interested in why you think I'm "anti-bike."
JohnD
Posts: 9
Joined: Dec 3rd, 2007, 8:35 pm

Re: Is there really a civic election in Vernon this year?

Post by JohnD »

First off, I did not report you as spam, that must be a privacy setting on my facebook.

Secondly, it makes no difference who, where or how the private message came to you. To post it ,or a reference to it, publicly is wrong and unethical. You crossed a line and therefore this communication stops, now.

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