Bkr. Is heart disease increasing around the World?

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zoo
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by zoo »

Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 13th, 2022, 9:35 am
zoo wrote: Mar 13th, 2022, 8:49 am Nice try, Obesity has been increasing every year to the point of 64% of Canadians in 2017 and higher today.
The top Medical and science organizations of the world clearly state most all cases are addressable and can be corrected through fitness and diet.
"To prevent obesity and maintain a healthy body weight, eat a well-balanced diet and exercise regularly."
It's pretty simple.
Why do we not stop trying so hard to justify this condition, we are using excuses.
If it was simple there wouldn't be so many obese people (I'm pretty sure it isn't 64% and higher).
There's a little more to it than just fitness and diet, since you actually cannot exercise your way out,
One would figure stat's Canada to be about the best source for this accurate info.
According to Statistics Canada, 61.3% of adult Canadians were overweight or obese in 2015.

"you actually cannot exercise your way out of it. A little bit more to it. "
This sounds like a belief created to support a needed ignorance to reality, again.
There is un limited sources to prove you wrong. From your science belief to actually making a change for personal health. However, I do not think any of it will mean anything.
Knock off every bit of processed, fast food for a month. Walk, run, bike every single day. It some how works for millions of people. More to it than that, nope, sure wasn't, it turned out to be nothing more than commitment.
These following statements all come from the top science, medical organization in the world that directly focuses on our health. Instead of having to fight back with an immediate rebuttal to discredit, dis allow, mis lead, what is clearly the obvious facts and measure's proven that can help people, why not acknowledge it and help with the movement for a change instead of constantly needing to deny science and facts that actually do help and contribute to everyone's health. Just because you do not like it.

Weight loss can often be achieved through a healthy diet and exercise.
Common treatments for overweight and obesity include losing weight through healthy eating, being more physically active, and making other changes to your usual habits.
https://www.news18.com/news/lifestyle/w ... 32096.html
While diet and exercise alone may not be enough to cure obesity, they are still two of the best ways to prevent it.
Silverstarqueen
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Silverstarqueen »

Gettting rid of sugar is a good place to start and might help those who are eating a bunch of it. I haven't had soft drinks, cookies, candies, fruit juices, sweetener in my coffee, and actually don't eat even fruit often, for many years. and all that certainly will help some people lose some pounds. But it won't do the trick for everyone. I know because I read comments by people who still get "stuck" at some weight plateau when they have pounds left to lose. How come doctors haven't really figured out something that is "simple" as suggested? It's "simple" for people with a young and wonderful metabolism. It was "simple" for me years ago. But something happens in the interim that makes it not so simple for ordinary people. That's supposed to be where our doctors come up with something besides :"Lose weight" "Eat a balanced diet" "Get some exercise (which honestly, I never found exercise made any difference to my weight". Exercise is great for health, but it does not lose weight for many people, or they wouldn't be dieting like crazy or spending tons of money on supplements that also do not work.
Silverstarqueen
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Silverstarqueen »

zoo wrote: Mar 13th, 2022, 12:43 pm
Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 13th, 2022, 9:35 am
If it was simple there wouldn't be so many obese people (I'm pretty sure it isn't 64% and higher).
There's a little more to it than just fitness and diet, since you actually cannot exercise your way out,
One would figure stat's Canada to be about the best source for this accurate info.
According to Statistics Canada, 61.3% of adult Canadians were overweight or obese in 2015.
]
So if 61.3% is the percentage for overweight OR obese, would you say 64% is not accurate for percentage of obese?
Is it 40% overweight and 21.3% obese, or 50% overweight and 11.3% obese? or 30% and 31.3? There's a big difference in there. It's unlikely that they are all obese.
So "fitness and balanced diet" works for millions, we still haven't established what is a "balanced diet", even more important we haven't established how many calories that would be. And we really haven't established why it doesn't seem to have worked for 61% (or 64% if you will) of the population. I mean , that's a lot of people who don't seem to be getting the right advice. A lot of diabetics for instance, have been following their doctor's advice, getting exercise, and they say they generally just get worse from year to year, gradually. so something about that advice is not working. And cutting out sugar in the diet, which we would guess most diabetiics are doing that, is not working either. still we end up with, what about 10% of the population has diabetes? And there's a fair percentage of diabetics who are actually not overweight, what diet is "balanced" for them?
What about those sumo guys, 5 hours of training per day, 20 or more years off their life expectancy. Doesn't seem like exercise is working out very well for them.
Then there's the genetic tendencies, Asians and some indigenous people get diabetes at lower BMI's or much higher rates than some other groups. Latinos also seem to get metabolic syndrome easier that some other groups. Anyone figured out why?
Grandan
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Grandan »

zoo wrote: Mar 13th, 2022, 8:49 am Nice try, Obesity has been increasing every year to the point of 64% of Canadians in 2017 and higher today.
The top Medical and science organizations of the world clearly state most all cases are addressable and can be corrected through fitness and diet.
"To prevent obesity and maintain a healthy body weight, eat a well-balanced diet and exercise regularly."
It's pretty simple.
Why do we not stop trying so hard to justify this condition, we are using excuses.
Herein lies the problem. What exactly is a well balanced diet? There are as many variations as there are people. And what exactly is exercise? What causes obesity? Some say fat, I say sugar and highly processed food.
The food pyramid does not adequately address the issue of what we should be eating and food manufacturers muddy the waters with their so called healthy snacks. If I could point a finger at the single worst thing you could ingest it would be soft drinks loaded with sugar and fruit juices that have equal amounts of sugar in them. Coffee drinks sometimes are loaded with sugar.
It is a scientific fact that fructose which represents 50% of the molecules in table sugar are shunted directly into the liver and are turned into fat. If you could do one thing in your life to avoid negative health consequences it would be to give up sugar altogether. Unfortunately sugar is addictive and most people cannot give up sugar if their life depended on it.
Waste not
Grandan
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Grandan »

Spoiler alert, it is not always about weight loss. There are in fact more people in the USA who are normal weight but are metabolically unhealthy than there are overweight people who are metabolically unhealthy.
Yes you can be fat and metabolically healthy and live a long life free of disease. Thinness does not alway equate to healthy.
The primary difference is the amount of visceral fat on them. You can have non alcoholic fatty liver disease and appear thin on the outside. It is called TOFI, thin on the outside fat on the inside, yes it is a thing. Check out some videos by Dr Robert Lustig Jr.
You can be thin and have diabetes, thin and have heart disease, thin and have Alzheimer’s disease. You can be an elite athlete and die of a heart attack.
Waste not
Silverstarqueen
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Silverstarqueen »

There must be many relatively heart healthy overweight people, since 61% are overweight or obese, but only 20% of deaths are due to heart disease.
Grandan
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Grandan »

Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 13th, 2022, 11:13 pm There must be many relatively heart healthy overweight people, since 61% are overweight or obese, but only 20% of deaths are due to heart disease.
The problem is that heart disease takes a while to kill you. You could live with heart disease for decades before you develop problems. It is not instantaneous. You can improve your chances of not developing heart disease by maintaining a healthy body composition through diet and exercise. There are many problems that can develop when you are overweight vs. maintaining a healthy weight. Humans have a wide spectrum of resistance to disease and tolerance for certain foods, there is no one size fits all, it is a spectrum. Babies are being born with multiple problems due to the lifestyle of their mothers so it is important to understand what good nutrition is to give our children the best start in life.
Body fat is now considered an organ which has consequences for the rest of your body.
Waste not
Silverstarqueen
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Silverstarqueen »

I was looking at a study re: obesity and covid deaths, and they picked some countries for comparison.
So I did a rough check (the stats in the study were done in spring 2020 so out of date already), currently:
Rate of obesity in males in u.s.46.4%, covid deaths per million 2973, so lets call it nearly 3000.
Rate of obesity in males in Poland 23.7% (quite a difference), with 3000 covid deaths per million.
Virtually no difference in the covid mortality rate per population. Huh.

So sure, some countries follow the pattern, notably some asian countries, but there were also many differences in their public health measures, like tracking and tracing from early on, lots of mask wearing etc. far more intense than Canada or u.s., or u.k.

I am not saying there is no correlation between obesity and covid deaths, but the articles talking about this connection, and the studies need to tease out the differences better. When there's a population like the u.s. where almost 70% are overweight, it's not surprise then that 75% of covid deaths are overweight. We need more clarity. We need to know why 200 million overweight, 100 million of these people, obese, did NOT die of covid.
Grandan
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Grandan »

Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 14th, 2022, 8:35 am I was looking at a study re: obesity and covid deaths, and they picked some countries for comparison.
So I did a rough check (the stats in the study were done in spring 2020 so out of date already), currently:
Rate of obesity in males in u.s.46.4%, covid deaths per million 2973, so lets call it nearly 3000.
Rate of obesity in males in Poland 23.7% (quite a difference), with 3000 covid deaths per million.
Virtually no difference in the covid mortality rate per population. Huh.

So sure, some countries follow the pattern, notably some asian countries, but there were also many differences in their public health measures, like tracking and tracing from early on, lots of mask wearing etc. far more intense than Canada or u.s., or u.k.

I am not saying there is no correlation between obesity and covid deaths, but the articles talking about this connection, and the studies need to tease out the differences better. When there's a population like the u.s. where almost 70% are overweight, it's not surprise then that 75% of covid deaths are overweight. We need more clarity. We need to know why 200 million overweight, 100 million of these people, obese, did NOT die of covid.
There are many factors that affect the outcomes of Covid19 . Vaccination rates, age of the infected person, masking and social interaction. Some of the overweight or obese were as young as babies, adolescents or otherwise young healthy adults.
In Poland there may be factors such as the degree to which people are out actively walking, cycling or using public transit vs. using your own car for everything and attending super spreader events. There are simply too many variables to make any meaningful comparisons.
Waste not
Silverstarqueen
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Silverstarqueen »

I would like the experts to get serious about the dietary advice. "Eat more fruits and veggies, while not harmful, is first, probably not at the root of the problem, and second, quite expensive for low income families. I have not heard health advisors address the cost of protein sources for low income families, who are loading up probably on bread, cereals, potatoes, and can't afford good protein sources like cheese, eggs, chicken. When a good quality loaf of bread is4-6$, broccoli $2 a pound, and a whole chicken $12, while rents and cost of gas are skyrocketing, "Houston, we have a problem", they haven't even clothed their kids yet, and there's no money at the end of the week.
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Grandan »

Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 14th, 2022, 9:12 am I would like the experts to get serious about the dietary advice. "Eat more fruits and veggies, while not harmful, is first, probably not at the root of the problem, and second, quite expensive for low income families. I have not heard health advisors address the cost of protein sources for low income families, who are loading up probably on bread, cereals, potatoes, and can't afford good protein sources like cheese, eggs, chicken. When a good quality loaf of bread is4-6$, broccoli $2 a pound, and a whole chicken $12, while rents and cost of gas are skyrocketing, "Houston, we have a problem", they haven't even clothed their kids yet, and there's no money at the end of the week.
If it was up to me the second thing I would drop from my diet after sugar would be bread and after that potatoes. Keep the eggs and turn to olive oil for the high quality calories. Cheese is also a very good source of protein, and not the kind that comes in a jar that is spreadable.
When it comes to clothes, I buy virtually all my clothes from Value Village, mostly on seniors day. Kids clothes are often barely worn before the kids grow out of them.
If you really want a measure of health then you might want to look at the incidence of type 2 diabetes in the USA which has some concise statistics from the CDC for cities and states. Both the highest rates and the lowest rates.
Dr Ken Berry is a great doctor and shoots straight from the hip when providing good information on diet and health. Diabetes is a strong measure of metabolic health and blood sugar levels are a finite quantifiable indicator.
Your A1C which is your average blood sugar level measured over 3 months should be below 6.0 although some say 7.0 is still ok. Mine is 5.0. My neighbour’s is 21. Yikes!
If you do not know what your A1C is then find out quick. You could be pre-diabetic or worse, diabetic and not know it. Your A1C is probably the most important health indicator and one of the easiest to measure.
https://youtu.be/2DwgWt7Z83A
Waste not
Zedi
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Zedi »

Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 13th, 2022, 8:36 am Sumo wrestlers train for 5 hours a day, and skip breakfast, proof that, as you say, you can't exercise away excess weight, and just fasting does not equate to healthy weight. Some people in the west eat, practically like a sumo wrestler, without the 5 hours a day training, plus may or may not eat a hearty breakfast, and wonder why they gain weight.
https://betterme.world/articles/sumo-wr ... stlers_Eat

Average lifespan for a sumo wrestler is 20 years or so less than an average japanese male.
Unless they catch covid and it goes side ways, lop off another 30 years from that life expectancy.
https://au.sports.yahoo.com/shobushi-su ... 25865.html

Turns out you also cannot exercise your way out of covid death.
Turns out you cant inoculate your way out of covid death or getting infected. Good job big pharma! Way to take taxpayer money for a :cuss: product!
Zedi
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Zedi »

Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 14th, 2022, 9:12 am I would like the experts to get serious about the dietary advice. "Eat more fruits and veggies, while not harmful, is first, probably not at the root of the problem, and second, quite expensive for low income families. I have not heard health advisors address the cost of protein sources for low income families, who are loading up probably on bread, cereals, potatoes, and can't afford good protein sources like cheese, eggs, chicken. When a good quality loaf of bread is4-6$, broccoli $2 a pound, and a whole chicken $12, while rents and cost of gas are skyrocketing, "Houston, we have a problem", they haven't even clothed their kids yet, and there's no money at the end of the week.
Health advisers are captured the processed food corporations(nestle). You need to see a holistic nutritionist if you really want to learn to eat the best possible way. Whether its food or drugs, the FDA does not have our health in mind. They approve the food(processed) that make us sick and the drugs to treat the sickness. Conflict!

Start here for learning to eat a whole food diet. https://nourishingtraditions.com/
Last edited by Zedi on Mar 14th, 2022, 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by Catsumi »

There are a number of misconceptions about sumo wrestlers that should be clarified.

Sumo wrestlers are VERY fit and healthy and are comparable to ballet dancers in muscle tone. They retire early for the same reason as football players do…their bodies take a lot of punishment. Participating in sumo beyond age 30 (max 35) is asking for grievous injuries.

Upon retirement many cut back on eating and become “normal” statured men, but of course, some find the change difficult and do not succeed.

https://thejapaneseway.com/sumo-wrestle ... rs_Fitnbsp
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zoo
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Re: Is heart disease increasing around the World?

Post by zoo »

Silverstarqueen wrote: Mar 14th, 2022, 9:12 am I would like the experts to get serious about the dietary advice. "Eat more fruits and veggies, while not harmful, is first, probably not at the root of the problem, and second, quite expensive for low income families. I have not heard health advisors address the cost of protein sources for low income families, who are loading up probably on bread, cereals, potatoes, and can't afford good protein sources like cheese, eggs, chicken. When a good quality loaf of bread is4-6$, broccoli $2 a pound, and a whole chicken $12, while rents and cost of gas are skyrocketing, "Houston, we have a problem", they haven't even clothed their kids yet, and there's no money at the end of the week.
So your trying to make a point that low income families cant eat healthy because it cost's too much?
And according to medical organizations around the globe the richest countries seem to be struggling with the world highest obesity rates. And then, Canada at a 64% overweight and obese status, are you saying this 64% is mostly related to the low income families? You said you didnt believe that the overweight and obesity of our country sits at 64%. Are you saying Stat's Canada is fake and mis leading?
A sack of healthy potatoes at Costco is less than a big mac. A bunch of carrots is less, Beans, head of cali. I can make a pot of chili for a fraction of a family of 4 eating at mac. D's.
Your trying far to hard , to always change the narrative to what you require.
After you google search what your trying to make others believe in, challenge the medical and science based organization's that clearly yet again tell you your wrong.

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