The push to end homelessness.

[Mtn Biker]

I,m about done about this subject, with some of the idiots on here, The proof of insanity is when theses idiots keep saying we must keep doing the same thing to help these people that don't want the help,And yet they keep getting the SAME result.Same people on the streets year in and year out. Go hang around down town and you can witness this first hand, And all you folks in Kelowna who have the answers by hosting a special day for the homeless, Good luck, Let me know how that works out for you.When you yutzs complain about drunks druggies and skids on your streets,that scare you. Well I gave you the answer, with the re-instatement of the varancy laws. I don't care about the drunks druggies and skids or their rights, If you want them off the streets, Thats the ONLY way it will work. PERIOD.!!!!!

Maybe if you quit with the name calling and labeling of people you would get more respect for your opinions. Maybe if you could write an argument people could comprehend you would get more respect. Maybe if you lived a little longer, experience more of life, had met with some difficulty and had to deal with it, you would have more empathy. What you are doing is belittling everyone here who doesn't agree with your opinion, not to mention the subjects of this thread. So from what we're reading, you are part of the problem. When one can see homelessness for what it is, instead of what one's self-righteous agenda says it is, we can foster real solutions to the problem and move forward.

[amomof2dogs]

Is it just me or is the concept of a scavenger hunt pushing shopping carts around city park offensive to anyone else? If a fundrdaising event is to take place to benefit homeless people it shouldn't be done in a way that makes a mockery of the lives some homeless people live.

[james-d]

well mtn biker I am older than you, Have had REAL hard times ,Have been without a home ,Job, vehicle ,money or even decent clothes, That is why I know about these issues, So unless you have lived it, And pulled yourself up from it,I do not think you understand ,That we will not rid ourselves of this problem unless they are made to do it themselves!!!!!!!! the ones with severe mental issues must be placed in a hospital,where they can be treated,The rest in my books are ,now and will always be lookin for the handouts, And if you understand anything about the human condition, MOST but not all just need a GOOD *bleep* kickin.They have a lot of ways to get around the system, get themselves to a warm climate and enjoy the handouts, SEND them to Winnipeg they will find jobs and become usefull, DO you understand that??? if not, go ask your dad or anyone else not of this young self entitled, brainwashed , group of young folks who have no Idea how to solve the problem.

[WhatThe]

Ha Ha I was right a lot of the young people are brainwashed and ignorant The old guys are the ones that know!! Didn't YOU know that ,what the????

When I say voting dinosaurs I'm not referring to seniors that have valuable insights to share, I'm referring to those that cling to might is right and pull up your bootstraps crowd. The ones that just refuse to listen to what experts have to say in favour of their own beliefs that generally have no basis in psychology, genetics or biology. You know, the facts as presented by evidence, not what we used to do in the good ole days that brought us to this point. Clearly there's a plank in your own eye.

[james-d]

Spoken like a true brainwashed student who believes the so called experts have all the answers, These so called experts of the modern education system that obviously have ALL the answers,But Can't figure out a way to make it work .Ask your parents,they will tell you what works, always has and always will, and the proof is the thousands who have achieved better for themselves, By having their *bleep* KICKED. GET IT ?????????

[Mtn Biker]

well mtn biker I am older than you, Have had REAL hard times ,Have been without a home ,Job, vehicle ,money or even decent clothes, That is why I know about these issues, So unless you have lived it, And pulled yourself up from it,I do not think you understand ,That we will not rid ourselves of this problem unless they are made to do it themselves!!!!!!!! the ones with severe mental issues must be placed in a hospital,where they can be treated,The rest in my books are ,now and will always be lookin for the handouts, And if you understand anything about the human condition, MOST but not all just need a GOOD *bleep* kickin.They have a lot of ways to get around the system, get themselves to a warm climate and enjoy the handouts, SEND them to Winnipeg they will find jobs and become usefull, DO you understand that??? if not, go ask your dad or anyone else not of this young self entitled, brainwashed , group of young folks who have no Idea how to solve the problem.

It seems you didn't learn much from your experiences. Everyone I know who has been down your path and made it, has a way different attitude at the end of the journey than you're displaying. So though you write about such hardships, I am not convinced you lived them. Kind of pathetic to say if you didn't. Either way, your attitude does nothing to resolve the issue, it just points fingers and lays blame. Perhaps something that brought you to hardships door in the first place? But continue with the insults and rhetoric if it is what you're about. . . . And, we thought you were done with this thread?

[Pkunko]

GET IT ?????????

At first I didn't "get it", but the eight extra questions marks helped me understand.

[sanfish]

well mtn biker I am older than you, Have had REAL hard times ,Have been without a home ,Job, vehicle ,money or even decent clothes, That is why I know about these issues, So unless you have lived it, And pulled yourself up from it,I do not think you understand ,That we will not rid ourselves of this problem unless they are made to do it themselves!!!!!!!! the ones with severe mental issues must be placed in a hospital,where they can be treated,The rest in my books are ,now and will always be lookin for the handouts, And if you understand anything about the human condition, MOST but not all just need a GOOD *bleep* kickin.They have a lot of ways to get around the system, get themselves to a warm climate and enjoy the handouts, SEND them to Winnipeg they will find jobs and become usefull, DO you understand that??? if not, go ask your dad or anyone else not of this young self entitled, brainwashed , group of young folks who have no Idea how to solve the problem.

While your posts confirm some obvious deficiencies with grasping the English language , it's starting to look like the problem extends to your grasp of elementary school Math. There are far more jobless people than they're are jobs ( not to mention the underpaid and underemployed ). Of course there are some lazy ( otherwise capable) people who prefer the handout than working ( I'd say small percentage) , but for everyone that "pulls up their bootstraps and applies themselves" one more would be left out of work. There is no magic solution to these problems in the context you're making it out to be, but the actual solution is easier than "our leaders" would have us believe ( I use the word believe rather than "think" because if more people actually started to think the world would be a much different/better place. We live in a world of abundance and are only told otherwise to help feed the greed of those who benefit from our confusion ( all price based systems require growth and "scarcity" to succeed for those few who put us in it). I don't believe in equality if for no other reason than different things make different people happy. What I do believe in is equal opportunity, and that couldn't be further from the reality we sadly find ourselves in. The system isn't broken , it was built this way.

In short , Canada was founded on the principle of " Noblesse N' oblige" ( the more fortunate take care of the less fortunate) . Not only are we duty bound to care for those, but as a society we should want to. In fact, I'd rather my hard earned tax dollars go to feed/shelter/heal people in need ( even the "lazy such and suches") , than to bombing other nations into submission, bailing out banks ( who work hard to devalue our currency and don't even pay income tax on the Billions try make), govt waste/corruption/collusion or any of the other absurd places our money goes.

[flavorflav]

You make some good points Sanfish,especially about having our noses in other country's affairs. It's high time we got out of every country other than our own,clean up our own mess and set a good example for the rest of the world to look at.Part of that would mean sorting out the charity for those who really need it,and those who say you need it. I sense James-T's frustration as well in that I've been a working taxpayer my whole life and I have trouble handing out so much when I have trouble making ends meet myself.I have no trouble helping people but when it just gets squandered on people who abuse the system,I have a big problem. I feel worst for the abused woman who has to feed a kid or two and then for the people who are actually sick.As for the drug addicts etc,I don't have as much sympathy.Round em up,put them in a camp and get em clean.If that's not good enough,how about a one way ticket to a better country willing to take them

[flavorflav]

You make some good points Sanfish,especially about having our noses in other country's affairs. It's high time we got out of every country other than our own,clean up our own mess and set a good example for the rest of the world to look at.Part of that would mean sorting out the charity for those who really need it,and those who say you need it. I sense James-T's frustration as well in that I've been a working taxpayer my whole life and I have trouble handing out so much when I have trouble making ends meet myself.I have no trouble helping people but when it just gets squandered on people who abuse the system,I have a big problem. I feel worst for the abused woman who has to feed a kid or two and then for the people who are actually sick.As for the drug addicts etc,I don't have as much sympathy.Round em up,put them in a camp and get em clean.If that's not good enough,how about a one way ticket to a better country willing to take them

[CorkSoaker]

I feel worst for the abused woman who has to feed a kid or two and then for the people who are actually sick.As for the drug addicts etc,I don't have as much sympathy.Round em up,put them in a camp and get em clean.If that's not good enough,how about a one way ticket to a better country willing to take them

That is pretty contradictory as drug addicts are actually sick.

[sanfish]

You make some good points Sanfish,especially about having our noses in other country's affairs. It's high time we got out of every country other than our own,clean up our own mess and set a good example for the rest of the world to look at.Part of that would mean sorting out the charity for those who really need it,and those who say you need it. I sense James-T's frustration as well in that I've been a working taxpayer my whole life and I have trouble handing out so much when I have trouble making ends meet myself.I have no trouble helping people but when it just gets squandered on people who abuse the system,I have a big problem.

I would like to attempt to clarify 2 misconceptions ( purposely put there by those that would benefit from our confusion).

A) it's not about having to take more out of your pocket after being taxed so much as you stated ( although I'm sure many people would agree that a little charity goes a long way). It's more about waking up as a society and realizing things don't have to be as we've been told they have too ( that in fact being a "better" society would actually be easier and less expensive). It's about exercising out democratic duty and insisting that whichever party gets into office actually represents the wishes of the people not the "Crony Capitalism" that is today's reality.

B) I often hear about those "milking the system". Strangely enough , it's most often spoken in regards to some otherwise capable individual "milking" a whole $600/month on welfare when he could be working ( I'd now like to point out that I have a different definition of "milking" a system than some other posters in here). Rarely does it get mentioned that those that are truly milking the system are our so called "leaders" ( in "quotes" because they were never supposed to be our leaders but merely our representatives adMINISTERing the wishes of the people) . As a society we have lost our way. We have been made to believe certain "truths" that couldn't be further from the truth. All this to benefit an ever shrinking portion of the population. It is not the poor, sick ( yes even drug addicted), downtrodden that have the sense of entitlement , but rather those at the very top of this rigged food chain who have it the worst. If anything, it IS the poorest and worst off amongst us that truly should feel entitled to something as it is the very practices of the "elite" that had caused this reality. What can welfare fraud really cost us? 3 Billion/yr? 5 Billion? Really? The govt spends 60 Billion/yr paying interest to private Banks for a debt common sense says we shouldn't even have. These Banks not only work hard to devalue the purchasing power of our currency ( read "inflation " the hidden tax), but don't even pay income tax on the Billions they earn. When these banks fail they are deemed "too big to fail" and are then given tax funded bailouts in the hundreds of millions ( 2008) . There is even pending legislation of a "money grab" from depositors accounts should another banking failure be imminent ( we have privatized obscene not taxable profits while socializing losses to the perpetrators). This supposedly peaceful country spends almost 20 Billion/yr on Military ( read to help spread democracy by bombing people till they agree with us). The proposed increase ( 5 Billion)to this budget could provide free post secondary education to any Canadian who wished it). We allow our natural resources/wealth to be extracted by multinational corporations ( the effect of " Free Trade" which is neither free nor good for trade) while suppressing technologies/localized economies which would actually be a benefit ( to both quality of life and the environment).

The world would not have to "look" very different at all to be completely different /better

[flavorflav]

Hey Corksoaker,drug addicts made themselves sick unless of course someone held a gun to their head while they hit the crack pipe or whatever it is they're hooked on.THEY are the ones who became addicted and yes,we should help them to an extent.No question about it.But when does that cycle end.
I venture to say what's missing in our society is the middle of the road voter,you know,the middle class that has been slowly decimated over the years. I think the majority of the middle class has slowly reached a state of apathy watching the upper class steal things away and tired of all their hardearned tax dollars be constantly abused at all levels of government

[CorkSoaker]

Hey Corksoaker,drug addicts made themselves sick unless of course someone held a gun to their head while they hit the crack pipe or whatever it is they're hooked on.THEY are the ones who became addicted

They are still sick, so what is your point? We still provide services to smokers and overly weight people whose health woes are mostly of their own doing.

and yes,we should help them to an extent.No question about it.But when does that cycle end.

What cycle are you talking about?

I venture to say what's missing in our society is the middle of the road voter,you know,the middle class that has been slowly decimated over the years. I think the majority of the middle class has slowly reached a state of apathy watching the upper class steal things away and tired of all their hardearned tax dollars be constantly abused at all levels of government

I can agree, but unfortunately the middle class is shrinking as the income gap and inequality grow.

[steven lloyd]

I would like to attempt to clarify 2 misconceptions ( purposely put there by those that would benefit from our confusion).

A) it's not about having to take more out of your pocket after being taxed so much as you stated ( although I'm sure many people would agree that a little charity goes a long way). It's more about waking up as a society and realizing things don't have to be as we've been told they have too ( that in fact being a "better" society would actually be easier and less expensive). It's about exercising out democratic duty and insisting that whichever party gets into office actually represents the wishes of the people not the "Crony Capitalism" that is today's reality.

B) I often hear about those "milking the system". Strangely enough , it's most often spoken in regards to some otherwise capable individual "milking" a whole $600/month on welfare when he could be working ( I'd now like to point out that I have a different definition of "milking" a system than some other posters in here). Rarely does it get mentioned that those that are truly milking the system are our so called "leaders" ( in "quotes" because they were never supposed to be our leaders but merely our representatives adMINISTERing the wishes of the people) . As a society we have lost our way. We have been made to believe certain "truths" that couldn't be further from the truth. All this to benefit an ever shrinking portion of the population. It is not the poor, sick ( yes even drug addicted), downtrodden that have the sense of entitlement , but rather those at the very top of this rigged food chain who have it the worst. If anything, it IS the poorest and worst off amongst us that truly should feel entitled to something as it is the very practices of the "elite" that had caused this reality. What can welfare fraud really cost us? 3 Billion/yr? 5 Billion? Really? The govt spends 60 Billion/yr paying interest to private Banks for a debt common sense says we shouldn't even have. These Banks not only work hard to devalue the purchasing power of our currency ( read "inflation " the hidden tax), but don't even pay income tax on the Billions they earn. When these banks fail they are deemed "too big to fail" and are then given tax funded bailouts in the hundreds of millions ( 2008) . There is even pending legislation of a "money grab" from depositors accounts should another banking failure be imminent ( we have privatized obscene not taxable profits while socializing losses to the perpetrators). This supposedly peaceful country spends almost 20 Billion/yr on Military ( read to help spread democracy by bombing people till they agree with us). The proposed increase ( 5 Billion)to this budget could provide free post secondary education to any Canadian who wished it). We allow our natural resources/wealth to be extracted by multinational corporations ( the effect of " Free Trade" which is neither free nor good for trade) while suppressing technologies/localized economies which would actually be a benefit ( to both quality of life and the environment).

The world would not have to "look" very different at all to be completely different /better

Great post sanfish !