Camp Fire Ban

[Noisy Boater]

I don"t give a rats buttox if you claim to be a responsible backwoods outdoor enthusiast. There is absoluteley no reason for campfires plain and simple. No reason whatsoever. 1 forest fire caused by anyone is 1 to many.

[atenbacon]

As evidenced by the post above there are some folks that live a sheltered and sad existence, but that is just my opinion and how I view those that don't enjoy the pleasure of camping outdoors.

I for one have and will continue to show my children how to be good stewards to the lovely country we live in. They have in their time learned to start, tend and extinguish a camp fire. Learned how to hike in any area and not leave trash everywhere. They have learned to fish hunt and in essence care for the land they lay foot on.

As for the irresponsible ones out there, they rank in the same low-life status of those that want to rip the very rights we as citizens of this Country hold dear. To those that say we should ban just because there are irresponsible people out there that is just plain dumb talk.

I respect bans in extreme conditions, as there are extenuating circumstances and the potential for a fire even for those that are cautious, but for normal conditions there should not be any talk of bans.

No reasons for a campfire whatsoever? I say there are dozens of reasons for a campfire and there are many that would agree.

[Noisy Boater]

As evidenced by the above post some people just dont get it. In my sad and sheltered life we do own a 26ft travel trailer and camp extensively. We have a propane campfire gadget that works wonders. You sound like a campers hero to the rest of us no minds.

[skydawg]

Camp fires are great. I look forward to having several of them this year.

[davis123]

I don"t give a rats buttox if you claim to be a responsible backwoods outdoor enthusiast. There is absoluteley no reason for campfires plain and simple. No reason whatsoever. 1 forest fire caused by anyone is 1 to many.

Are you aware there are multiple reasons that wildfires start? When a fire is "human-caused", this doesn't strictly mean that a campfire started it.

If you think campfires should be banned then I guess you think the following should be banned as well?
- vehicles
- recreation vehicles
- cigarettes
- glass
- eyeglasses
- lighters
- matches
- propane
- gas
- native ceremonies that use fire

And we better invite Mother Nature to this thread so we can let her know that lightening is banned, starting now as well.

As evidenced by the above post some people just dont get it. In my sad and sheltered life we do own a 26ft travel trailer and camp extensively. We have a propane campfire gadget that works wonders. You sound like a campers hero to the rest of us no minds.

Some don't get it?? Are you referring to yourself?

Lots of campers don't consider hauling out the portable hotel room on wheels with your propane fire as 'camping'. You do understand having campfires has been happening since, oh gee... forever! People who are camping without a travel trailer cannot just turn on the furnace to get warm, they use fire as a source of heat and for cooking and to keep away animals.

How exactly are you teaching your kids (if any) how to deal with fires, how to start them, how to extinguish them properly, how to cook on them? If a kid has only experienced propane fires don't you think that is slightly useless in the real world when a fire is required? Guaranteed the kids that have grown up learning to camp responsibly, with the opportunity to practice survival skills, like building fires, are going to fare much better in a situation when those skills are required to keep themselves alive. And they will know the appropriate way to extinguish a fire, instead of looking for the "off" button.

If anything, the people who are newbs with camping and dealing with fires are the problem out there, they think they know what they are doing, they toss a cup of water on the fire and walk away. Or the idiots who are just up there to have raging fires and get drunk.

These are some necessary skills in life that I want both of my kids to know. I never want them in a situation where they require a fire for warmth to survive or to eat and they don't have a clue what they are doing. That propane fire isn't going to help when the propane runs out, and at that point your kids would die from hypothermia and my kids would throw another log on the fire. What if your kids become hiking enthusiasts, are they going to haul a propane campfire on their back while they walk 40 kilometers? My kids would skip the propane campfire and bring matches/lighter and use the abundance of wood laying in the forest.

There's another great reason for campfires, who do you think cleans up all the debris laying around campgrounds, sticks, fallen trees, etc.? Not the people using the propane fire that's for sure, it is the people who have a good ol fashioned fire that are cleaning that crap up.

Some families like to spend their time golfing, or watching movies, or whatever..and some like to spend their time camping, and that includes doing all the standard survival type activities that go along with it, like a campfire. I consider this getting back to our roots, experiencing life how it has always been in the past. I think it is incredibly important for my family to learn everything about it, just because you don't think so, doesn't make it so.

I do have to comment on your profile name here, Noisy Boater, does this profile name imply that you use a gas engine with your boat? If so, you do know how bad that is for our lakes, right? I don't think that is very environmentally friendly at all, but you know what, I don't get to decide everything or decide on banning things, so go for it buddy, you do your thing and I'll do mine :) RESPONSIBLY

[Noisy Boater]

My noisy boat will never start a forest fire . Fires only start 2 ways . Lightning by Mother nature or humans. You are not Mother Nature. If you can think of any magical event other than those two please share. Humans can cause forest fires. Plain and simple. It may be a campfire to scare away creatures or from your chainsaw , gas ,oil, exhaust, backfire or many other possabilities as have been mentioned above. Will disagree forever on this issue. You do your thing try not to burn down the forest and I will do mine buddy.

[Frisk]

Fires only start 2 ways . Lightning by Mother nature or humans

Kinda off topic but lava is known to cause fires in Hawaii. Another way is spontaneous combustion which sometimes occurs naturally in areas with large amounts of decomposing matter like a bog.

[Fancy]

Camping sites have made it easy to have campfires by giving one a place to have the fire and supplying firewood.

[Frisk]

Bottom line, there's no need for any sort of ban if the conditions don't require it. If conditions change, so can the restrictions.

[davis123]

My noisy boat will never start a forest fire . Fires only start 2 ways . Lightning by Mother nature or humans. You are not Mother Nature. If you can think of any magical event other than those two please share. Humans can cause forest fires. Plain and simple. It may be a campfire to scare away creatures or from your chainsaw , gas ,oil, exhaust, backfire or many other possabilities as have been mentioned above. Will disagree forever on this issue. You do your thing try not to burn down the forest and I will do mine buddy.

Exactly, human caused fires can be caused by a multitude of reasons. Campfires are just one of the many reasons. There is no need for campfire bans unless the Province mandates it. When campfire bans are not in place people should still use discretion, sometimes there isn't a ban but you can easily see it is too dry and maybe they haven't had a chance to update the signage or see the area for themselves.

The propane camp fire you referred to earlier is a great alternative when there is campfire bans though.

No worries about me burning down the forest, I am one of those responsible ones remember. Watch the idiots out there drinking and ripping around drunk, throwing their trash all around, those are likely the culprits that leave campfires unattended.

[Frisk]

Open burning ban starts May 15th for the kamloops fire centre (includes the Okanagan).

http://www.castanet.net/edition/news-story-165609-3-.htm#165609

[trapp]

I probably know as much about campfires in the Kelowna area as anyone on this forum. Having a wildfire career that spans 52 years. The last 20 patrolling the area of the Penticton Fire Zone East of Okanagan Lake as a Fire Warden. Now here is my take on it. Most of the problem campfires are illegal to start with, too large, no water, bush parties, no containment, unattended, or left not extinguished. These situations above occur both during campfire season and during fire bans.

Most of the areas, about 99%, where campers have campfires are very fireproof and as long as rules are followed relative to not leaving unattended, having a pail of water, a shovel, and extinguishing when you leave, go for a swim, go for a nap or go to bed for the night.

In all the wildfires I have seen originating from campfires they were all from non compliance. Those non compliance campfires occur from the list I posted above. Many camping areas police themselves, another camper will soon notify you if you are in non compliance, or notify authorities. In most of the campsites where there is problem other campers come to us when we patrol the campsite and we then have a little chat and take details of the offending party.

Over the past few years in my patrol area people have become far more responsible. Where I used to have several incidents per weekend patrol, these have really become rare. For instance in the long fire ban of last summer patrolling 4 days a week I did not record one incident. I do however know of a couple that fire departments attend to. Campers and outdoor recreationalists have become very accustomed to meeting fire patrol personnel out on patrol, Fire Wardens, Conservation Officers, RCMP, and Forestry I & E Officers. We are all out there when the hazard warrants it and cover a lot of area. Expect a fine if you are in non compliance.

Is there a need for a fire ban now? Absolutely not. You would have trouble getting a fire to spread at most of the fishing camping lakes right now. The only danger may be in the valley bottoms, and even now we have substantial "green up". We seen an early campfire ban last year, beginning of July, first time in recent memory. In my opinion it was more political than actually needed. It is not easy to impose an early campfire ban, then rescind it, then put it back on. A fire ban requires signage, patrols and enforcement, a costly endeavor. Once we are in a position, build up, and higher hazard I will be the first one to endorse a ban. Lets not be silly about this but logical.

[Frisk]

Thanks trapp, you explained that well. It's nice having someone with first hand experience around here.

[Glacier]

Open fire burning has been banned in the Cariboo since April 4th. It was for a while in the Prince George fire center for a while, but have since been loosened in some areas.

[mexi cali]

Exactly, human caused fires can be caused by a multitude of reasons. Campfires are just one of the many reasons. There is no need for campfire bans unless the Province mandates it, but even then people should use discretion, sometimes there isn't a ban but you can easily see it is too dry and maybe they haven't had a chance to update the signage or see the area for themselves.

I agree with you all the way but I want to point out the word "discretion" in the quoted part of your post.

That is where the plan falls apart because as Trapp pointed out, campfire caused fires are for the most part due to non-compliance.

As with all things in life, it is the minority who cause issues for the rest so what do you do?

Again, as per Trapp who seems to know what he/she is talking about; if there is no immediate need for a ban, put the gun back in the holster.

The fine though for anyone found to be responsible for starting a forest fire at anytime needs to be swift and painful and very, very public.