Crane collapse downtown

[Fancy]

*removed*

[Scrobins94]

When it is all said and done and the dust settles - I think this incident will have an impact on the rubber stamping of these towers going up down town. And IMO will have an impact on high cranes and their proximity to other buildings/residents/businesses in the area. That's the big take away from this incident. When I was in class for a safety course at BCIT - a worksafe guest speaker put it best. Many sections and addendums to the safety guide and regulations was unfortunately written in blood.

This incident was a gigantic tragedy. It was 2 interior companies on the rise to new heights. And now there will be a lot of question marks to answer.

I think you're over estimating the long term impact of this accident.

While tall buildings are new to Kelowna. They're not new to the rest of the world. As mentioned by a previous poster - crane collapses occur globally on a weekly basis. Big impact to Kelowna where we've never seen one before, but globally it's just another week.

I really doubt this will have any impact on approval of additional high rises. Construction techniques aren't even a consideration when it comes to approval - CoK has absolutely zero influence or care when it comes to that topic. There's a reason it's called "National Building Code" and not "Kelowna Building Code" ;)

"As mentioned by a previous poster - crane collapses occur globally on a weekly basis"

Great. So business as usual. Cranes collapse every day, people can die. It's just a part of the job description... Hey, you signed the contract!

[nucksRnum1]

Great. So business as usual. Cranes collapse every day, people can die. It's just a part of the job description... Hey, you signed the contract!

Excellent observation. The innuendo of business is business or I know better about things because status quo - is why safety is a big part of construction these days. I have a couple of friends in Worksafe. This incident will make things very uncomfortable for a large group of people at Stemmer and at Mission Group. That's what happens in an investigation. It's black and white. And I don't revel in that at all. That's not to say that there was malfeasance by The Stemmers or at Mission group. You would have to be insane if you think they wanted this tragedy to happen. And it makes things even more sad.

It illustrates the impact this incident will have on our city. Whether it was the paramedic rescue that had to see these poor unfortunate souls dead. Or the RCMP that may have seen these poor workers dead. Or the neighbors in buildings that thought there was an earthquake or saw things happen live. How about the many tradesmen on site - a peer of their own didn't make it home. Or how about those in offices where people just barely made it out but by the grace of god. It even has an effect on people who frequent these forums - I have been thinking about this incident a lot. Its sad.

[Trixster]

I saw the video vacancyrate is referring too and yes it looks as though the one worker isn't wearing any fall restraints. If his family plans on suing they wont get far based on the video.

[ferri]

I hope these people are successful.

Recovery mission in day 3
Specialized team arrives to help retrieve body from Kelowna crane collapse rubble

https://www.castanet.net/news/Kelowna/3 ... pse-rubble

[W105]

just saw on the news that the 5th person has been recovered..

[oneh2obabe]

^^^Body was recovered around midnight by the specialized team brought in.

https://www.castanet.net/edition/news-s ... htm#339897

[Fancy]

Just so sad and can't imagine the chaos down there.

[TylerM4]

Excellent observation. The innuendo of business is business or I know better about things because status quo - is why safety is a big part of construction these days. I have a couple of friends in Worksafe. This incident will make things very uncomfortable for a large group of people at Stemmer and at Mission Group. That's what happens in an investigation. It's black and white. And I don't revel in that at all. That's not to say that there was malfeasance by The Stemmers or at Mission group. You would have to be insane if you think they wanted this tragedy to happen. And it makes things even more sad.

All I said is that crane collapses happen frequently and it's unlikely that investigations in Kelowna will uncover some great new understanding or finding or safety protocol(s). This is a fact. I'm sorry it's not a fact you like, but getting upset about it isn't going to change anything. Facts are NOT opinions. I have not shared my opinion - you've fabricated one and attempted to stick it in my mouth.

To imply that by sharing that fact I'm brushing off the seriousness or impact on those closely involved is just silly.

[Even Steven]

So if Kelowna Fire Department had to bring in a specialized team to perform the rescue, is it now fair to say that Kelowna isn't even proportionately prepared for high rise emergencies?

No, it's not fair to say. Highly specialized teams like this are always shared - if you read the story carefully you'll see that there are only 6 of these teams for the entire country.

[Even Steven]

Good point! These teams are only located where they are needed. Kelowna doesn't need them.

Nope, they travel the country to be where they're needed.

Just like we always have to wait for a bomb disposal unit to show up because we don't have one locally nor do we need one.

Just like the police ERT team that is also rotates through out the province and we don't have one locally nor do we need one.

[Rejigger]

Good point! These teams are only located where they are needed. Kelowna doesn't need them. (*sarcasm*)

Nope, they travel the country to be where they're needed.

Exactly. They're only needed when there's a failure. To suggest that Kelowna needs a team permanently positioned here is to suggest there's a high likelihood of failure. The numbers won't support that.

[Even Steven]

That's absolutely not how it works my friend.

Well, given the number of municipalities in the country with high rises, and only SIX (6) highly specialized rescue teams for the entire country - meaning that all these municipalities don't have one just like Kelowna, you are obviously proven wrong.

[TylerM4]

Well, given the number of municipalities in the country with high rises, and only SIX (6) highly specialized rescue teams for the entire country - meaning that all these municipalities don't have one just like Kelowna, you are obviously proven wrong.

Thanks. Got a real kick out of that post. As you've clearly stated - only 6 cities in all of Canada have this service. Cities MUCH bigger than Kelowna. Someone clearly has no idea what they're talking about.


A whopping total of 1 crane collapse in the entirety of Kelowna's history:
Armchair experts - CoK leadership sucks, they don't know what they're doing, we need a specialized rescue team, etc.
Cok - OK we'll spend millions of dollars annually in case it happens again someday simply to avoid a couple of days delay bringing in a specialized team from out of city.
Armchair experts at tax season - CoK leadership sucks, they're spending money like it's going to expire and can't control costs.

[Terris]

I'll stand tall on this one and shut you down. That's absolutely not how it works my friend.

Kelowna is relying on the rest of the world/country for absolutely everything. To people like yourself who rely on others to do all your dirty work, this seems normal and OK.

To anyone that has spent a career in any type of labor or emergency services knows the real story. It is extending so far now that we can't even rescue our own citizens due to the technical nature of how the city is building and the lack of personnel.

I suppose when one of these buildings collapses, we will call in the crew from Miami who are already trained.

I suppose when one catches fire, we will call on the other communities to help.

If you pay attention to the news, West Kelowna can't build highrises because of the cost of equipment and training for their firefighters.

Yet our city managers, and many many other white shirts are telling us that we will call on the Westside Fire Department, who is untrained in high rise firefighting (as per Chief Brolund) to help??

We are calling on the rest of the world to help us when we can't even tie our own shoes.

At what point are the speculators and capitalists going to wake up and realize that there is a life outside of money...there is a life outside of growth.

I'm not saying this would change ANYTHING on the outcome of this event but I'll leave you with this.

Is it fair that we are all paying the same, if not more, insurance rates as other cities who have all the protections in place and has trained staff ready to respond?

I don't feel it is, but money aside, I only care that the people that go to work to serve an employer and come home alive. I only care about the safety of the people in this city. I don't care if someone doesn't make enough to take their family on a nice vacation.

However, after much reading on these forums over the years, it's clear that I stand differently than many on this forum. So many keep pushing people like myself aside for the excuse of "the future" or "growth".

An elderly lady stood at the sidewalk on St. Paul the day after the accident. She looked devastated, as all of us are. But the words she spoke rung so true.

"Are they done yet? Why are we building these when no one here wants them? Now at the expense of lives lost."

I know it could happen anywhere and on any job site in the world. However, I feel it's time to take a check at yourselves and ask yourself if this is what you really want.

Do you really want highrises? If so, ask yourself for what. For what reason are we doing this to Kelowna. Is it only for looks? Are we sacrificing lives for looks?

I can tell you one thing..it's definitely not bringing families here and it's definitely not providing affordable living.

Again, my condolences to all those involved. Nothing is more tragic than this...nothing.

Just wait till the sinkholes start appearing amidst this cluster of erections being built by competing rich kids, who are constantly twisting the arms of city council, to build ever higher. This hi-rise building idiocy will become especially problematic if the lake levels drop in our new climate paradigm.

These concrete behemoths are being built here on pile cap foundations, on what is essentially sandy, glacial till swampland, similar to how most of Florida's swampy urban centers were built up.

I wouldn't be surprised now, if a foundation shift beneath the crane slab, was found to be a contributing factor to this tragic collapse.

We're only one moderate earthquake away from seeing these buildings bend flaccidly over each other due to liquefaction.

I can only imagine what the insurance rates will be in the future. Who will be held responsible then??

Anyone here remember what happened when Kelowna's first leaning hi-rise, the Kiwanis Tower, was built? The engineers then, also thought they knew what they were doing.

Today you can't find any information on that engineering problem, due to the information being buried by those with "$kin" in the developer game, and who are painting these new projects in all shades of $un$hine and $mile$...

My prediction is, that at some point no external specialized Urban Rescue Team will be able to save the day for us.

Not all development equates to progress...