Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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bb49 wrote: Aug 27th, 2021, 2:03 pm This is the response from the Canadian government to those stuck in Afghanistan.

E9tsnAzUUAkk8f8.jpg
https://twitter.com/BryanPassifiume/sta ... 30/photo/1
i think that even jt's father pierre would be ashamed of his coward son at this time
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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The people that needed to get out knew that the clock was ticking for many months.
Is it really JT's fault that the situation has become so dangerous that it isn't practical or smart to risk further lives? What happens if one of those aircraft gets hit by a MANPAD or RPG? War is dynamic ....no one thought the country would fall this quick and maybe cancelling further flights is actually quite smart.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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oldtrucker wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 11:43 am The people that needed to get out knew that the clock was ticking for many months.
Is it really JT's fault that the situation has become so dangerous that it isn't practical or smart to risk further lives? What happens if one of those aircraft gets hit by a MANPAD or RPG? War is dynamic ....no one thought the country would fall this quick and maybe cancelling further flights is actually quite smart.
The Americans publicly announced last April they would be pulling out of Afghanistan by the end of August, privately America’s allies, including Canada undoubtedly knew about the pull out date long before April... There’s no justifiable excuse for the Trudeau government to wait until the eleventh hour to start rescuing Afghanistan citizens that were employed by the Canadian military.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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oldtrucker wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 11:43 am The people that needed to get out knew that the clock was ticking for many months.
Is it really JT's fault that the situation has become so dangerous that it isn't practical or smart to risk further lives? What happens if one of those aircraft gets hit by a MANPAD or RPG? War is dynamic ....no one thought the country would fall this quick and maybe cancelling further flights is actually quite smart.
These people definitely knew well in advance, but Justin and crew fiddled and diddled and did nothing to help these people get their paperwork in order. Now they are totally screwed. Justin' team told a bunch of Afghans to wait by the gates dressed in red, and they would be helped, and no one showed up. Guess what, now everyone including the Taliban know that those people are collaborators with the infidel, and they have a good chance of being slaughtered, in some pretty gruesome ways. Great job Justin!
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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The Green Barbarian wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 1:38 pm These people definitely knew well in advance, but Justin and crew fiddled and diddled and did nothing to help these people get their paperwork in order.
Hurtlander wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 1:36 pm here’s no justifiable excuse for the Trudeau government to wait until the eleventh hour to start rescuing Afghanistan citizens that were employed by the Canadian military.
oldtrucker wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 11:43 am no one thought the country would fall this quick
Or maybe the US/ coalition did know. Maybe things got way too sketchy too quick.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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The Green Barbarian wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 1:38 pm
oldtrucker wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 11:43 am The people that needed to get out knew that the clock was ticking for many months.
Is it really JT's fault that the situation has become so dangerous that it isn't practical or smart to risk further lives? What happens if one of those aircraft gets hit by a MANPAD or RPG? War is dynamic ....no one thought the country would fall this quick and maybe cancelling further flights is actually quite smart.
These people definitely knew well in advance, but Justin and crew fiddled and diddled and did nothing to help these people get their paperwork in order. Now they are totally screwed. Justin' team told a bunch of Afghans to wait by the gates dressed in red, and they would be helped, and no one showed up. Guess what, now everyone including the Taliban know that those people are collaborators with the infidel, and they have a good chance of being slaughtered, in some pretty gruesome ways. Great job Justin!
Trudeau didn't take the situation seriously - this sort of casual neglect is one of the defining hallmarks of his government.

Then, when it was obvious he'd failed the people for whom he was responsible, he tried to cover it up with a promise that shows he STILL doesn't take the situation or his responsibilities seriously - two more defining hallmarks of his government. The casual neglect of duty, inflated ego, vacuous promises.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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It is what it is. It's history now. Spilled milk. Let's see what we can all do better going forward.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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nucksRnum1 wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 5:55 pm It is what it is. It's history now. Spilled milk. Let's see what we can all do better going forward.
Time for you to realize what side your toast is buttered on. If we ever need help from another nation our personnel will be screwed.


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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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So you are saying that after 20 years of war and conflict - and the countries who started the wars losing interest - not to mention shrinking budgets - that getting out being a mess is Bidens and Trudeau's fault? I am almost choking on the conservative bias. Which were the ones that started a 20-year war. If any responsibility should be taken - that's where it should start.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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nucksRnum1 wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 7:42 pm So you are saying that after 20 years of war and conflict - and the countries who started the wars losing interest - not to mention shrinking budgets - that getting out being a mess is Bidens and Trudeau's fault? I am almost choking on the conservative bias. Which were the ones that started a 20-year war. If any responsibility should be taken - that's where it should start.
It's how we got out of Afghanistan. Getting into it and shrinking budgets (what the heck is that?) are not part of getting out of Afghanistan and accepting 20,000 Afghans.

It didn't help that Justin took off on an election campaign, and left his bureaucrats to clean up the mess.
https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/ ... fghanistan
“We have a couple of people who are trying to process thousands and thousands of applications, and it’s just not working,” Kevin Newman, a former journalist and volunteer with Veterans Transition Network told the CBC.
Andrew Rusk, co-founder of a group called Not Left Behind, suggested Canada’s few remaining officials were doing their best, but “because of our delays, because of the paperwork, because of the bureaucracy,


Canada had several months notice to get a realistic escape plan in place, but no, Trudeau had an election to look after.

And whoever started this war, it was not any Conservatives in Canada.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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nucksRnum1 wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 7:42 pm I am almost choking on the conservative bias. Which were the ones that started a 20-year war. If any responsibility should be taken - that's where it should start.
Jean Chretien wasn't a Conservative.

He was a dastardly Liberal.
When did Canada send troops to Afghanistan?

7 October 2001

After the United States' invasion of Afghanistan, the first Canadian battle group went to Kandahar on 7 October 2001. In this deployment, the Canadians protected Kandahar Airfield and supported American operations.

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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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Afghanistan is a country that is not understood by outsiders.

The British Empire tried 3 times to change Afghanistan - and each effort turned into a disaster. The last time was not long after WW1. 3 strikes and you're out - and each time a debacle.

The Soviets tried in 1929 to change Afghanistan and again in 1979 - and each effort turned into a disaster and a debacle - the last one contributing heavily to fall of the Soviet Union.

Somehow our ally the USA thought it would be different in 2001. As a staunch allies of the USA, Britain, Canada, Australia, Germany and many other countries went with the Americans to tilt at the Afghanistan windmill.

Pakistan, who have a much better understanding of Afghanistan played along reluctantly and played both sides of the "game" - giving safe harbor to the Taliban and others all the way to Al Qaeda and Osama Bin Laden.

In the end, the USA led coalition had the same success as the British Empire and the Soviet Union. None at all, and have covered themselves in ignominy as Afghanistan has once again made fools of outsiders who do not understand it.

Canada is not alone in failing to understand how fast things revert to the past in Afghanistan. Western "intelligence" failed to understand the centuries old three dimensional chess that was and is in play. Afghanistan, Iran, Pakistan, Iraq... and others in the region might as well be Martians as far as western "intelligence" is concerned - especially when that limited intelligence runs up against a wide array of political leadership that has no clue, just we as everyday folks don't, as the reality of Afghanistan.

The only insight that I have is that stepping into Afghanistan has been the equivalent of stepping on a land mine for outsiders. Step on it, and you must stay put forever, and when your patience and ability to withstand the elemental forces of Afghanistan has run out, it will blow up in your face as step away.

The end result is only a better armed Afghanistan - where British Empire rifles from the 1880s were still in use 2011 and now replaced with arms and weaponry that western countries so generously gave to the "Afghan Army".

The speed at which the Taliban "took over" took us by surprise. We do not seem to learn. The Taliban never left Afghanistan, yes they pulled the part that western countries do recognize into safe harbor in Pakistan and other countries, but is obvious now that the Taliban were always right there where they had always been.

And so the American Empire and its allies leave Afghanistan in the same fashion as the Soviet Empire and the British Empire before them, confused, regretful and in shock and shame. Afghanistan truly is "the graveyard of empires".
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

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The Liberals were all to happy to send our brave soldiers to combat in Afghanistan in rusted out dune buggies, and this directly caused many deaths and injuries.

Military budget cuts since 1993 are to blame, when Chretien became PM, not coincidentally.

Serfs like our military men and women are just pawns to the Liberal elites, who sipped champagne and dined on caviar as our soldiers died needless deaths due to Liberal indifference.

Afghan Blast Stirs Debate on Canadian Military Spending


Posted: Oct 04, 2003


The deaths of two Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan from an explosive device that blew a huge hole through their aging all-terrain vehicle has set off new debate in Canada over military spending after years of slashed budgets.

Opposition politicians and some military experts have suggested that Sgt. Robert Alan Short, 42, and Cpl. Robbie Christopher Beerenfenger, 29, who were killed while on patrol on Kabul's outskirts on Thursday, might have survived had they been in a more modern, armored vehicle like those used by American forces.

They were the first Canadian military deaths in a combat zone since four Canadian soldiers were mistakenly killed in Afghanistan in April 2002 in an attack by an American warplane. Canada currently has 1,950 troops in Afghanistan, where they constitute the largest allied force protecting Kabul.

The two soldiers were riding a 20-year-old Iltis all-terrain vehicle, which offers no protection against land mines and is far smaller, lighter and slower than all-terrain vehicles used by the American, British, German or French militaries. Three other soldiers were wounded.

Canadian military requests to replace the Iltis with a heavier and more powerful vehicle have been delayed during years of budget cuts since 1993.


''The real question is, why were our soldiers sent out into the foothills, into self-described bad-guy country, in unarmored, rusted-out dune buggies, rather than lightly armored vehicles,'' Jay Hill, a member of Parliament from the conservative Canadian Alliance Party who specializes in military affairs, said in the House of Commons on Friday.

Canadian newspapers were filled with vitriolic criticisms of the Iltis from retired military officers. One unnamed soldier in Afghanistan was quoted in The Edmonton Journal as describing the all-terrain vehicle as ''a bit of an albatross around our neck.'' Soldiers are known to sit on their flak jackets when riding in the Iltis when driving through combat zones to give them a modicum of protection.

''This jeep should have been replaced a decade ago,'' said David Bercuson, director of the Center for Military and Strategic Studies at the University of Calgary. ''The complacency in this government over defense is extremely thick.''

https://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/04/worl ... nding.html
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

Post by foenix »

bb49 wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 8:03 pm
nucksRnum1 wrote: Aug 29th, 2021, 7:42 pm So you are saying that after 20 years of war and conflict - and the countries who started the wars losing interest - not to mention shrinking budgets - that getting out being a mess is Bidens and Trudeau's fault? I am almost choking on the conservative bias. Which were the ones that started a 20-year war. If any responsibility should be taken - that's where it should start.
It's how we got out of Afghanistan. Getting into it and shrinking budgets (what the heck is that?) are not part of getting out of Afghanistan and accepting 20,000 Afghans.

It didn't help that Justin took off on an election campaign, and left his bureaucrats to clean up the mess.
https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/ ... fghanistan
“We have a couple of people who are trying to process thousands and thousands of applications, and it’s just not working,” Kevin Newman, a former journalist and volunteer with Veterans Transition Network told the CBC.
Andrew Rusk, co-founder of a group called Not Left Behind, suggested Canada’s few remaining officials were doing their best, but “because of our delays, because of the paperwork, because of the bureaucracy,


Canada had several months notice to get a realistic escape plan in place, but no, Trudeau had an election to look after.

And whoever started this war, it was not any Conservatives in Canada.
It was Chretien that followed Bush Jr. to Afghanistan but it was Harper that escalated our presence because he wanted to show how tough he was to the world and the US. He also was responsible for us being there for 9 years instead of withdrawing finally in 2014. That's when all our Afghani allies should have been brought out as well but it was also Harper and Kenny that callously told our allies who put their lives at risk for our troops, "too bad, so sad" because you were already paid and knew the risks..... as they were left behind.

That's the REAL history of Canada's withdraw from Afghanistan in 2014, not the contrived and the fake election story that it was JT's fault, who was elected ONE YEAR AFTER Canada's withdraw from Afghanistan.
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Re: Canada accepting 20,000 Afghanistan's

Post by The Green Barbarian »

foenix wrote: Aug 30th, 2021, 10:59 am but it was Harper
LOL - here we go again. Justin just looks awful on this. Blaming anyone else for this debacle just makes it look even worse. BUT HARPER! - what a joke.
Justin Trudeau- racist, elitist, liar. What a sick piece of garbage.

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