Suing Interior Health for wage disparity

[gardengirl]

Does anyone here have a Nurse Practitioner as their primary caregiver? As in, instead of family doctor?

[marooned]

I'm an certified accountant. Someone with little to no education could, realistically, do my job. But ...

The little piece of paper does matter in the quality of decisions being made.

I think you both nibble around the edges of another core issue. Engineers, accountants and physicians are all accountable for and insure against the liabilities stemming from their decisions. They can be sued in a court for consequences of errors in judgement. The difference in payment is about level of education, sure, but also in part about owning the risk. BCCM does provide liability insurance as part of dues collection but is likely not to the level required by a physician to practice.

[Saviour]

It's stated in their claim that the NP and the GP's are doing equal work in these cases. Equal pay for equal work sounds fair to me.

There is more involved than just "equal work" when it comes to wage differentials, and rightfully so.

[JLives]

It's stated in their claim that the NP and the GP's are doing equal work in these cases. Equal pay for equal work sounds fair to me.

There is more involved than just "equal work" when it comes to wage differentials, and rightfully so.

Such as?

[Saviour]

Such as?

Education, qualifications, level of responsibilities, etc.

[countmeout]

Public perception on this topic is one thing, reality is another.

While your brilliantly trained engineer with all the schooling, i's dotted t's crossed is no doubt capable of memory and logic solving (proven by taking exams in school), they are not industry ready. They require experience to become fully competent in difficult tasks, sometimes they never pick up a full technical understanding with the ability to diagnose.

The best person for the job (and the one who should be paid accordingly) is someone who has done that task for years and can demonstrate without hesitation the most complicated portions of their expertise to someone who is completely green in this area of expertise. This isn't always the person with the multiple degrees on the wall.

If the doctors assume no more liability than the nurses, have no further responsibilities and not overseeing the nurses in any capacity, then its the same job and the doctors are overqualified for it. You wouldn't pay a mechanic at a tire shop the same wage as a mechanic at a heavy-duty truck repair outfit, just because they have a red seal ticket.

[JLives]

Such as?

Education, qualifications, level of responsibilities, etc.

If you are doing the same job it doesn't matter if the other person has more education. It seems maybe GPs are overqualified for the duties being performed perhaps. They are both equally qualified for the equal work being performed. They both have equal levels of responsibilities for the work being performed as cited in the OP's link.

[Saviour]

If you are doing the same job it doesn't matter if the other person has more education. It seems maybe GPs are overqualified for the duties being performed perhaps. They are both equally qualified for the equal work being performed. They both have equal levels of responsibilities for the work being performed as cited in the OP's link.

It certainly does matter - if one invests more time and money in ones field than someone else, it is more than reasonable to expect a higher return on that investment versus those who do not make the same sacrifice.

[Glacier]

Does anyone here have a Nurse Practitioner as their primary caregiver? As in, instead of family doctor?

My mom does. Many small remote communities have NPs but no GP.

[JLives]

If you are doing the same job it doesn't matter if the other person has more education. It seems maybe GPs are overqualified for the duties being performed perhaps. They are both equally qualified for the equal work being performed. They both have equal levels of responsibilities for the work being performed as cited in the OP's link.

It certainly does matter - if one invests more time and money in ones field than someone else, it is more than reasonable to expect a higher return on that investment versus those who do not make the same sacrifice.

Well no. It's just being overqualified for a given position.

[ash71]

It certainly does matter - if one invests more time and money in ones field than someone else, it is more than reasonable to expect a higher return on that investment versus those who do not make the same sacrifice.

Well no. It's just being overqualified for a given position.

You basically you think that someone who has studied all of the textbooks, knows human anatomy inside-out, is an absolute genius, but has never actually gone to school, should get paid the same amount as someone who has spent over 10 years (and over $250k+) being formally educated.

What about red seal certification? I can learn plumbing and electrical work from the internet... so I should be paid the same as a red seal tradesperson?

[YzzzR1]

Equity only works when ALL things are equal.

[JLives]

Well no. It's just being overqualified for a given position.

You basically you think that someone who has studied all of the textbooks, knows human anatomy inside-out, is an absolute genius, but has never actually gone to school, should get paid the same amount as someone who has spent over 10 years (and over $250k+) being formally educated.

What about red seal certification? I can learn plumbing and electrical work from the internet... so I should be paid the same as a red seal tradesperson?

NP's are educated and qualified. This is about a specific circumstance.

[Old Sailor]

NP's are educated and qualified.

Both NP's and GP's are educated up the ying yang1

Having said that when it comes to who I (personally) trust more (I see both) I trust my GP more.

He goes by the proven research whereas the NP goes more by what's generally accepted.

She pushes more new drugs and he doesn't.

[spooker]

People typically get paid for the value they provide to the employer, we love to have numbers to simplify things ...

If they can prove they provide a similar value as the physician why should a 70% gap be allowed?

I didn't finish my education so I was not always at the top of the stack of resumes but due to physical features I had no control over and an OCD-like focus on my general purpose skillset I was able to get into the 6-figure range by the age of 30 ... there are younger people making more than that coming out of college who I have to teach better skills to ...

Education is a good thing but I don't think it should be the singular differential between wage bands ...

That piece of paper puts you in a position to negotiate a wage. How else would an employer know what wage band you'd fit in? Of course, nurses and doctors rarely negotiate a wage, so some mechanism is in place to enforce a disparity based on a superior education.

Hiring a real engineer, rather than an electronics technician with years of experience is not the same, and rarely is. Perhaps both can design a circuit, and develop firmware, but I would expect a better performing design from a real engineer, that would have fewer bugs and better meet regulatory criteria. A position of higher education also has more public responsibilities.

Perhaps an electronic technician can provide similar value for easier tasks, but I would trust the engineer to provide outstanding value not reachable by a technician for more difficult tasks. If you do not need an engineer, do not hire one. Of course, if you do not hire an engineer, you risk having expensive unforeseen problems.

If someone doesn't have the skills for the job that will obviously be apparent ... and expectations are different when someone has that piece of paper ... though I remember some pieces of paper that were being handed out by Microsoft so many years ago that were getting people quite the wage and then watching those same people crash and burn as they couldn't handle the tasks

Should a patient expect less from an NP when the MD isn't available? Putting them in the same role with regards to the patient again doesn't seem to warrant a gap of 70% ... I know the MD has to pay off all those school bills but should there be a vastly different set of performance goals for the higher salary? Or is there? Again, the NPs in this case have to convince the court that their argument is valid ... since we don't seem to have that many of either type in this forum we definitely lack a basis for comparing the different levels of iron rings to skin tone ...