Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

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Urban Cowboy
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by Urban Cowboy »

Ebus sold the tickets to their Ebus passengers. The buses were contracted to Ebus so give it a rest already with the semantics, because at the time in question whomever was driving was doing it for the entity known as Ebus.

That's also how our ministry of transport and CVSE officers are investigating it.

You're simply coming off as someone attempting to defend the indefensible.
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Saviour
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by Saviour »

Urban Cowboy wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 8:45 pm Ebus sold the tickets to their Ebus passengers. The buses were contracted to Ebus so give it a rest already with the semantics, because at the time in question whomever was driving was doing it for the entity known as Ebus.
So, if Air Canada sells a ticket on a United Airlines flight and the United flight crashes, Air Canada and their pilots will come under scrutiny because Air Canada sold the ticket?

Lets just say, hypothetically, BlueStar has a series of infractions and Pacific Western Transportation does not, BlueStar could lose their operating certificate which would have zero implications on PWT other than they'd have to find a new subcontractor.

Again, this is much more than just "semantics".
Urban Cowboy wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 8:45 pmThat's also how our ministry of transport and CVSE officers are investigating it.
Is it? How so? Because Ebus sold the tickets? Pretty sure the Ministry of Transportation and the CVSE aren't too concerned about that - they're a little pre-occupied by road conditions, weather conditions, mechanical condition of the coach, driver error, etc.

Now, if Pacific Western Transportation has a history of infractions or incidents involving their own vehicles/employees, then that will certainly come under the microscope but a singular incident involving a separate company will hold no value or interest in the investigation. Feel free to correct me by explaining what relevance this will have in the investigation.
Urban Cowboy wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 8:45 pmYou're simply coming off as someone attempting to defend the indefensible.
Correcting factual errors is not "defending" anything.
Last edited by Saviour on Dec 27th, 2022, 9:20 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

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Saviour wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 7:58 pm A passengers account can be very skewed in perspective, especially after a traumatic event. Things look very different if one is in the drivers seat versus sitting 30 feet back behind the driver.
I think the story said they were sitting up front and that she had to pick broken glass off herself after the accident.

So not 30 feet back but right up front.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by Saviour »

Bsuds wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 9:00 pm
So not 30 feet back but right up front.
I was just using that to illustrate a point - perspective from a passengers point of view in a bus can be very deceptive.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by thesportinglife »

Tero wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 5:43 pm
thesportinglife wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 12:16 am I cannot comment on whether Ebus drivers drive too fast, or speed. However, I will share an incident that I saw at the Kelowna airport, a few weeks ago. I saw a lineup of 30 or more people waiting to load into an Ebus. The driver, a fat, overweight man, was acting very rude and was yelling and shouting at his mostly young passengers and appeared to be explaining the rules to them ?

Yes, I "get" that rules need to be made clear to people, but is yelling and shouting at your passengers, helpful ?
I say that the speeding of the Ebus under dangerous winter road conditions, is consistent with one who also shouts and yells at his passengers.

Why ? Because it shows that you are an "a hole" who does not care about the safety of the public? It's not just one incident, either. Maybe the PTB (Passenger Transportation Board) needs to look into the fitness of the licence holder (Ebus) to offer rides to the public, both safely and professionally.

if you were recently on an EBus and your experience was less than satisfactory, you need to write a letter to the PTB and tell them your side of the story. If enough people write in, then the PTB may call a hearing into the licensee's fitness to hold a permit to operate a bus service.
What the hell does this have to do with the crash??? And what the hell does being overweight have to do with anything? What are you talking about???
You don't get it, do you ? If the transit operator is rude and is heard yelling at his passengers and for no good reason, then, that translates into rudeness and taking unnecesary chances on the road, such as speeding. And speeding MAY well have been a contributing factor in that accident/crash.

That will all come out at the civil lawsuit trial (REST ASSURED !)
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by Scrobins94 »

Yes and the results of the investigation will come out in a billion years. The results of the Mission Group crane accident that killed several workers still hasn't been released and it's been over a year since it happened. It seems like regular people don't matter much.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by Bsuds »

Saviour wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 9:01 pm
Bsuds wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 9:00 pm
So not 30 feet back but right up front.
I was just using that to illustrate a point - perspective from a passengers point of view in a bus can be very deceptive.
That's not the way it came across.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by normaM »

I keep my seatbelt on while on a plane - the Bus was equipped with belts that might have prevented some of the deaths /injuries.
Thank goodness there were local residents and other vehicles on the road to help the victims.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

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MAPearce wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 7:30 pm
Yeah .. but he was on a bus because the plane said NO ?

Don't tell me that anyone on "The Bus" wasn't looking for a way to get where they WANTED to go ...

And they blame the driver ??

Sad really
There is no plane that goes to Lillooet.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by captkirkcanada »

Saviour wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 9:01 pm
Bsuds wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 9:00 pm
So not 30 feet back but right up front.
I was just using that to illustrate a point - perspective from a passengers point of view in a bus can be very deceptive.
Physics are same no matter where someone is sitting, the feeling of g forces for example doesnt change from front to back once the bus starts spinning .
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by Patron »

alanjh595 wrote: Dec 28th, 2022, 6:21 am
MAPearce wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 7:30 pm
Yeah .. but he was on a bus because the plane said NO ?

Don't tell me that anyone on "The Bus" wasn't looking for a way to get where they WANTED to go ...

And they blame the driver ??

Sad really
There is no plane that goes to Lillooet.
many people from here took the Ebus to Vancouver because Kelowna flights were shut down, and it was messing up their winter vacation
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by Saviour »

Bsuds wrote: Dec 28th, 2022, 5:05 am
That's not the way it came across.
My apologies, I should have been more explicit in that regard. Also, for further clarification, I am not attempting to discount Gordon's account, merely stating that witness accounts are not always the most accurate.
captkirkcanada wrote: Dec 28th, 2022, 6:34 am Physics are same no matter where someone is sitting, the feeling of g forces for example doesnt change from front to back once the bus starts spinning .
My post was in reference to a comment related to the previous accident, not because a bus was "spinning" - depth perception changes drastically from the drivers seated position and the passengers which is the point I was trying to make. I'm not sure what "G-forces" or "physics"have to do with how a driver is driving, sense of motion yes (which also changes depending on seating position in relation to the turning point of the vehicle).
thesportinglife wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 12:16 am I cannot comment on whether Ebus drivers drive too fast, or speed. However, I will share an incident that I saw at the Kelowna airport, a few weeks ago. I saw a lineup of 30 or more people waiting to load into an Ebus. The driver, a fat, overweight man, was acting very rude and was yelling and shouting at his mostly young passengers and appeared to be explaining the rules to them ?

Yes, I "get" that rules need to be made clear to people, but is yelling and shouting at your passengers, helpful ?
I say that the speeding of the Ebus under dangerous winter road conditions, is consistent with one who also shouts and yells at his passengers.

Why ? Because it shows that you are an "a hole" who does not care about the safety of the public? It's not just one incident, either. Maybe the PTB (Passenger Transportation Board) needs to look into the fitness of the licence holder (Ebus) to offer rides to the public, both safely and professionally.

if you were recently on an EBus and your experience was less than satisfactory, you need to write a letter to the PTB and tell them your side of the story. If enough people write in, then the PTB may call a hearing into the licensee's fitness to hold a permit to operate a bus service.
thesportinglife wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 10:15 pm
You don't get it, do you ? If the transit operator is rude and is heard yelling at his passengers and for no good reason, then, that translates into rudeness and taking unnecesary chances on the road, such as speeding. And speeding MAY well have been a contributing factor in that accident/crash.

That will all come out at the civil lawsuit trial (REST ASSURED !)
Your comments are nothing but empty assumptions that hold absolutely no merit what-so-ever.

In regards to your comment in writing the PTB to investigate Ebus, the fact that they have had no major incidents in the past shows that their operating certificate is in good standing. Add to that, online reviews have shown nothing but praise for the company and the drivers.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by 69cutlass »

captkirkcanada wrote: Dec 28th, 2022, 6:34 am
Saviour wrote: Dec 27th, 2022, 9:01 pm
I was just using that to illustrate a point - perspective from a passengers point of view in a bus can be very deceptive.
Physics are same no matter where someone is sitting, the feeling of g forces for example doesnt change from front to back once the bus starts spinning .
That is incorrect. When a bus spins those at the center axis of the spin would experience less force than those at the outside sweep of the spin. Ex. If the spun on the exact center of the over all length those in the center would feel less rotational forces than those at the front or rear. The force one experiences is dependent on the distance from the point of rotation.
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by alanjh595 »

AND what force ia felt when the motion comes to an abrupt stop?
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Re: Four dead in a bus crash on Connector Hwy 97

Post by oldtrucker »

69cutlass wrote: Dec 28th, 2022, 7:30 am
captkirkcanada wrote: Dec 28th, 2022, 6:34 am

Physics are same no matter where someone is sitting, the feeling of g forces for example doesnt change from front to back once the bus starts spinning .
That is incorrect. When a bus spins those at the center axis of the spin would experience less force than those at the outside sweep of the spin. Ex. If the spun on the exact center of the over all length those in the center would feel less rotational forces than those at the front or rear. The force one experiences is dependent on the distance from the point of rotation. Screenshot_20221228-072831_Samsung Internet.jpg
You guys forgot about gyroscopic precession....

Dude the bus driver is in a massive hurry before even getting to the bus to start the shift. I know I am no matter what I'm driving. You get rolling as fast as you can.
Pretrip inspection that if done by the book would take 2 hours. You kik the goddammed tires , make sure you have lites and get moving. The more you doddle around, the longer your day is and yes your in a hurry because you don't want to get stuck when roads are closed or traffic is backed up.
Hurry, get your class 1 or 2. You to can live the dream.
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