Deceiver prorogues, Iggy and Layton talk is OT here

[NAB]

Dunestraits wrote (referencing the Senate)...

"....but they serve no master...."

Surely you jest. To me that one comment destroys the credibility of an entire argument.

Nab

[westsidebud]

Dunestraits wrote (referencing the Senate)...

"....but they serve no master...."

Surely you jest. To me that one comment destroys the credibility of an entire argument.

Nab

not realy. i think he sted it very well, to the point and i think most canadians dnt want american fail war on drugs, infact most american states are starting to think ahead and will change drug laws for the better as in more education and treatment places

[Bagotricks]

Dunestraits wrote (referencing the Senate)...

"....but they serve no master...."

Surely you jest. To me that one comment destroys the credibility of an entire argument.

Nab

After that I wrote "...and thats the idea" I know its not stone cold policy, in absoloute terms.

It is a golden handshake and political nod to be picked to be in the senate, and everyone has their motives, but they dont get unelected, do they? Their "master" would be the people of Canada, which they served in the case of Bill C- 15, while the politicians were busy screwing everything up and putting themselves over the people.

[NAB]

Dunestraits wrote (referencing the Senate)...

"....but they serve no master...."

Surely you jest. To me that one comment destroys the credibility of an entire argument.

Nab

After that I wrote "...and thats the idea" I know its not stone cold policy, in absoloute terms.

It is a golden handshake and political nod to be picked to be in the senate, and everyone has their motives, but they dont get unelected, do they? Their "master" would be the people of Canada, which they served in the case of Bill C- 15, while the politicians were busy screwing everything up and putting themselves over the people.

I must be missing some part of your argument Dunestraits. From my perspective the Canadian Senate as currently constructed are not reponsible to the people of Canada, but rather to their political masters - "sober second thought" and all. But then I am a firm believer in the necessity for Senate Reform, as in an Elected Senate rather than an appointed one.

I suspect however we are starting to stray from the main intent of the topic here, and there are other threads around that are perhaps more suitable for discussing the specific problems with the Senate. I do agree that part of the issue concerning shutting down parliament for a spell provides an opportunity to appoint some more Senators as a byproduct, but I don't see it as a main issue in this case. Work needs to be done about the economy and recovering from the recession, and if it ain't getting done because the opposition and the senate keep throwing in red herrings like the Afghanistan situation and not focusing on the primary issues, then something has to give

Nab

[NAB]

The difference of course is that, unlike some significant elements of previous Liberal governments, the Harper government doesn't have a "shameful record" ;-)

Nab
***********************************

John Ibbitson

Ottawa — Published on Wednesday, Dec. 30, 2009 9:13PM EST Last updated on Saturday, Jan. 02, 2010 2:18AM EST

The Harper government's decision to have Parliament prorogued in the dead of Christmas week sets a record for taking out the trash.

That's the political term for a government dumping unwelcome or unpopular announcements at times when the news is likely to be ignored. Embarrassed by a damning report? Release it on a Friday afternoon before a long weekend.

Determined to short-circuit an investigation into how the government mishandled the treatment of Afghan detainees? Wait until the eve of New Year's Eve – when MPs are in their ridings or down south, readers and viewers are few, and that day's news is dominated by the picks for the men's Olympic hockey team – and suspend Parliament.

For anyone who believes that our governments should be honest, open and accountable, this is a travesty. But it's devilishly clever.

A senior government official, speaking on background, insisted that calculations concerning the Afghan detainees controversy played no part in the decision.

Rather, said the official, the government wanted to give itself time and breathing room to think through how to manage the economy as it emerges from recession and to put in place a long-term strategy for balancing the budget.

Conservatives will tell you that this newspaper, a few other journalists and opposition politicians are the only ones concerned with the detainees issue. It's “old news,” as press secretary Dimitri Soudas put it in a conference call with reporters yesterday.

That government officials or politicians may have been negligent in safeguarding the treatment of Afghan detainees, thus violating the Geneva Conventions, is of no real concern to most Canadians, the Tories maintain.

They are almost certainly right. But the fact remains that proroguing Parliament shuts down the committee that was the source of the most embarrassing revelations about government bungling in Afghanistan. The Military Police Complaints Commission, which was also looking into the affair, is effectively suspended until the government gets around to appointing a new commissioner.

By government design, all official inquiry into this matter has been terminated until March, at least. The Conservatives aren't concerned? They have a strange way of showing it.

There are plenty of other good reasons to prorogue, from the government's perspective. Stephen Harper will be able to rejig Senate committees to reflect the imminent arrival of five party loyalists whom we all expect him to appoint early in the new year. The Throne Speech, now scheduled for March 3, and the budget on March 4 will politically embarrass the opposition parties, forcing them once again to support a government they detest rather than bring on an election that would devastate the Liberals, in particular.

In partisan political terms, proroguing Parliament this week was inspired.

All we lose is a chance to talk. Had Parliament reconvened Jan. 25, as originally planned, MPs could have debated the priorities for the coming budget; the government's plans – oh, sorry, lack of plans – to meet its Copenhagen promise to do something, some day, about fighting global warming; whether and how to reform pensions in both the public and private sector; Canada's future commitments in Afghanistan. That is what Parliament was to have talked about through February, before it was silenced.

“It's no way to run a business,” as NDP Leader Jack Layton put it yesterday. But never mind: The people will have their Olympic circuses, and the government can plan for our future unhindered by oversight.

Mr. Layton remembers when Mr. Harper, as leader of the Official Opposition, lambasting the Chrétien government's plans to prorogue Parliament back in 2003, to prevent the Auditor-General from reporting on possible abuse of the sponsorship program in Quebec.

“The government will prorogue the House so that it will not be held accountable for its shameful record,” Mr. Harper thundered.

But that was so long ago.

[westsidebud]

how soon they forget huh nab

[Liberty and Truth]

“It's no way to run a business,” as NDP Leader Jack Layton put it yesterday.

This from a clown who has never spent a day in his life in the real world, instead spending it suckling from the government teat, doing everything in his power to disrupt and harm businesses where-ever possible. He wouldn't know how to run a lemonade stand without introducing regulations on the stand that all the lemons have to be union hand-picked and of course unionizing all the children selling the lemonade so that they get a minimum wage of $20 a hour plus benefits, and then finally launching a human rights complaint against the parents because there aren't enough minority, handicapped or gay children selling the lemonade. In other words, the stand would be out of business in about 10 minutes.

Jack Layton offering an opinion on how to run a business is farcical, and the irony of his statement would be on par with Hugo Chavez lambasting Saudi Arabia for practicing censorship, or Al Gore critiquing Bernie Madoff for being a fraud.

[Logitack]

spring election is the reason for poroguing??

Spring 2010 election? Pundits say yes
By Crawford Kilian January 1, 2010 05:30 pm 20 comments
http://thetyee.ca/Blogs/TheHook/Federal-Politics/2010/01/01/SpringElection/
Does the prorogation of Parliament presage a spring election? Two respected pundits say yes; a major pollster reports growing Conservative strength.

Writing on the CBC website, Don Newman discusses Stephen Harper's likely strategy:

If Parliament returned as first planned on January 25, his administration would again be under fire over how much it knew about the torturing of Afghan detainees by the government in Kabul.

He also knew that, with a budget to be delivered on March 4, all those previous weeks in the House of Commons would have been filled with opposition suggestions for what to put in it.

Meanwhile, Norman Spector predicts in the Globe and Mail that April 13 will be election day. Among his reasons:

If Mr. Harper’s decision to prorogue Parliament was designed to thwart further investigation into the Afghan detainees issue (why else would he have done the dirty deed?), he will be looking to ensure from the get-go that the opposition parties don’t pick up where they left off as soon as the new session begins. A quick election call would neatly do the trick, especially given Canadians’ apparently lukewarm interest in the issue.

Spector bases his arguments in part on a December 30 Nanos poll that shows Conservative support up 2 points to 40% in mid-December. The Liberals are up 1 point to 30% and the NDP are up 1 to 19%.

Perhaps more significantly, the Nanos poll also shows that when Canadians are asked who would make the best prime minister, Ignatieff is down 6 points to 18% and Layton is up 4 points to 15%. That makes Harper's own 2-point drop to 35% less worrying for the Conservatives.

[grumpydigger]

If Harpo did get a majority even his greatest supporters would be shocked by the polities he would bring out........In a minority government at least he has to be controlled in his thinking.............

[steven lloyd]

i think he sted it very well,

What does it mean to “sted’ something ???

[Al Czervic]

“It's no way to run a business,” as NDP Leader Jack Layton put it yesterday.

This from a clown who has never spent a day in his life in the real world, instead spending it suckling from the government teat, doing everything in his power to disrupt and harm businesses where-ever possible. He wouldn't know how to run a lemonade stand without introducing regulations on the stand that all the lemons have to be union hand-picked and of course unionizing all the children selling the lemonade so that they get a minimum wage of $20 a hour plus benefits, and then finally launching a human rights complaint against the parents because there aren't enough minority, handicapped or gay children selling the lemonade. In other words, the stand would be out of business in about 10 minutes.

Jack Layton offering an opinion on how to run a business is farcical, and the irony of his statement would be on par with Hugo Chavez lambasting Saudi Arabia for practicing censorship, or Al Gore critiquing Bernie Madoff for being a fraud.

All quite true. Jack Layton has indeed never run a business much less a Popsicle stand. He has been a politician almost his entire career and has been exclusively living off the avails of the taxpayer. This includes the time he and his spouse were caught living in a subsidized housing co-op in spite of the fact they had a combined healthy six figure taxpayer financed income.

[Fritzthecat]

Typical lazy *bleep* fat cat Konservatives, expecting to get paid for staying home. Just as bad as all those bums on welfare, except we pay the politicians more....and yet nobody seems to complain about them?

Hypocrisy at its finest.

[SpaceAddict]

I guess there is even a FaceBook group now dedicated to this topic.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=260348091419

[NAB]

Matt Gurney: Anti-Harper Facebook group picks and chooses its censorship

Excerpts from: http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blog ... z0bpH2Ixmr

""...I was on the air today with my friend Charles Adler, a guest on his show, discussing the creation of a Facebook group protesting the Harper government's decision to prorogue Parliament. I think that Facebook groups are just about the dumbest way to advocate a political cause because, as I said on air, they draw out the lowest common denominator.

...I was joined on the radio by Christopher White, creator of the group. I asked him about these pictures, and he skated around the issue with admirable aplomb (might be a career in politics for him, he's got a knack for dodging direct questions).

...Until my old friend Asher went on the site and posted a comment mocking the group (see it reposted below). It was deleted within minutes.

...So let me get this straight. You don't have time to delete hateful images of the Prime Minister, but a post mocking you gets zapped right away?

...Citizens, take a long look at what you see here. Such is the face of modern progressivism. Comparing the Prime Minister to a genocidal madman? A-okay with us. Mocking us guardians of democracy and progressivism? Way out of line.

...When these guys clean up their website, maybe they'll be worth listening to. In the meantime, they're just another bunch of rabid anti-conservatives, doing their best to show that intolerance is no longer the right's game.

...Nothing like watching a bunch of entitled socialists telling others to get back to work. Truly a treat.

...The executive branch of government is, of course, still functioning, which is what "accountability" and "responsibility" speak to. The only thing that is not happening right now is that laws are not being passed. How... is this inherently a bad thing? Certainly a government is necessary and laws must be passed; but I don't see how a vacation from legislation leads to tyranny. In every historical instance, it has been the presence not the absence of legislation that has produced oppression.""

[Al Czervic]

What I find funny about this whole “proroguing” non issue is that when the Liberals/Socialists/Separatists were plotting their unholy alliance to try and assume governance of Canada all three of these groups argued that their alliance was a legitimate tool of parliamentary procedure and there was nothing wrong with their making use of it.

Now when the shoe is on the other foot and Harper is legitimately using a tool of parliamentary procedure the accusations of abuse of power from the same Liberals/Socialists/Separatists are staggering. How pathetically lame is that.

Further Iggy and Layton say Parliament should get back to work. News flash, Harper never stopped working. As was reported yesterday he has been in Ottawa at his deck at work. Meanwhile who has been on vacation and not working ? Why that would be Iggy and Layton. How greasy is that. How you loons in the left support this type of hypocritical crap is beyond me. But then again many of you were also prepared to support the unholy alliance of the Liberals/Socialists/Separatists as well. Only it was OK to use Parliamentary procedure to your political advantage back then right? It’s only not OK when someone else does the same thing.