Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

[cv23]

Thank for the post Lowrenzo .. see you are new here. Curious, where did you get a figure of 98%? I do share the road and try very hard to be nonreactive to whatever the real percentage of cyclists is who ruin it for a small minority. One does not have to drive very far to experience bad cyclist attitude. Unfortunate but true. Before the flood gates open -- yes, I agree you can say the same about bad drivers in our area as well. So what is the answer?

The answer is education and accountability for all those using our roads.
All operators need to be licensed. Licensing would show that at least at one point in time the operator knew and understood the rules/laws pertaining to safe operation of their vehicle. By requiring licensing those operators who disobey the rules/laws can be identified and disciplined if necessary. Operators of boats and planes are required to be licensed. So are the operators of automobiles, motorcycles, and trucks so why shouldn't every operator of a vehicle using the roadways be licensed?
Licensing would also go a long way in seeing that more of the vehicles on the road meet all the legal equipment requirements as it is the operator's responsibility to ensure the vehicle they are operating is properly equipped.

At one point in time at least Kelowna required the licensing of all vehicles operating on the roads. Why the municipality ended this revenue stream is unknown but if it was present today not only would it provide extra funds for enforcement of rules/laws but would go a long way in seeing lost or stolen vehicles re-united with their rightful owners.

Stiff fines for all infractions need to be set but also enforced. The rules/laws were enacted for the safety of all those sharing the roads and as such safety, the prevention of accidents, should become more of a priority for law enforcement.

Even if it is only 2% of any group that is causing the problems we are all encountering on the roads today remember the numbers of all groups using the roads only increases each and every year raising the actual number of law/rule breakers on the roadways. If we all spent more time obeying the rules, specifically those pertaining to the safe operation of the particular form of vehicle we may be operating at a given moment, then not only will we all be safer but our time on the roads would be less of the ordeal it has on occasion become.

[twobits]

The answer is education and accountability for all those using our roads.
All operators need to be licensed. Licensing would show that at least at one point in time the operator knew and understood the rules/laws pertaining to safe operation of their vehicle. By requiring licensing those operators who disobey the rules/laws can be identified and disciplined if necessary. Operators of boats and planes are required to be licensed. So are the operators of automobiles, motorcycles, and trucks so why shouldn't every operator of a vehicle using the roadways be licensed?
Licensing would also go a long way in seeing that more of the vehicles on the road meet all the legal equipment requirements as it is the operator's responsibility to ensure the vehicle they are operating is properly equipped.

At one point in time at least Kelowna required the licensing of all vehicles operating on the roads. Why the municipality ended this revenue stream is unknown but if it was present today not only would it provide extra funds for enforcement of rules/laws but would go a long way in seeing lost or stolen vehicles re-united with their rightful owners.

Stiff fines for all infractions need to be set but also enforced. The rules/laws were enacted for the safety of all those sharing the roads and as such safety, the prevention of accidents, should become more of a priority for law enforcement.



Even if it is only 2% of any group that is causing the problems we are all encountering on the roads today the numbers of all groups using the roads only increases each and every year raising the actual number of law/rule breakers. If we all spent more time obeying the rules, specifically those pertaining to the safe operation of the particular form of vehicle we may be operating at a given moment, then not only will we all be safer but our time on the roads would be less of the ordeal it has on occasion become.

If what you have just posted is a true reflection of what you believe is required, then I have nothing but a hand to extend to you in agreement.
I am however suspect in your interpretation of road right of way and the obligations of all users, as per the MVA, do not jibe with mine.
More specifically, I am concerned with your view that a cyclist can ride in a dedicated hwy lane of traffic, and lower the bar of traffic flow to the speed of the cyclist just because they are legally entitled to ride in that lane. My reading of the MVA says this is a potential situation that may happen, and it is the responsibility of the slow traffic (cyclists, heavy truck, or farm implement) to properly yield to traffic they are impeding at the nearest safe opportunity. In your previous posts, I have not seen you ceding to that rule of the road, nor do I in my daily travels see that happening either from the "comfortable pant wearers".

[jamapple]

If you're talking about highways, I must say the highways with a paved shoulder are few and far betwen. Most don't have any. So, where would a cyclist ride? If not in the right side of the lane, it would either have to be right on the little white line at the shoulder, or in the gravel. Anyone care to elaborate where they would be required to ride?

[cv23]

If what you have just posted is a true reflection of what you believe is required, then I have nothing but a hand to extend to you in agreement.
I am however suspect in your interpretation of road right of way and the obligations of all users, as per the MVA, do not jibe with mine.
More specifically, I am concerned with your view that a cyclist can ride in a dedicated hwy lane of traffic, and lower the bar of traffic flow to the speed of the cyclist just because they are legally entitled to ride in that lane. My reading of the MVA says this is a potential situation that may happen, and it is the responsibility of the slow traffic (cyclists, heavy truck, or farm implement) to properly yield to traffic they are impeding at the nearest safe opportunity. In your previous posts, I have not seen you ceding to that rule of the road, nor do I in my daily travels see that happening either from the "comfortable pant wearers".

Unfortunately for you the MVA is not open for interpretation by individuals, other than judges if need be. The rules are the rules and apply equally to all users unless there is a reference made to a specific type of vehicle.
If you take the time to look back I have never condoned breaking of any laws by anyone operating a vehicle on the road only that under the MVA cyclists have as much right to use the roadways as you in your bigrig, a fact you have incorrectly and vehemently disputed.
The rules of pulling over when impeding traffic due to failure to maintain a minimum highway speed apply to all vehicles and there is no reference that this only applies on level ground. Maybe we should start up a poll and see just how many times people have been caught in a long line of traffic behind a bigrig that was going to slow and how many have been caught in a long line of traffic behind a cyclist not maintaining appropriate speed?
How about we try some simple math? All vehicle operators are human so any mental defect will be equally present in all types of vehicle operators. If by this mental defect 2% of the vehicle operators on the road chose to disregard the rules/laws and there are a hundred times more motor vehicle operators than cyclists on the road which group makes up the vast majority of those breaking the law thereby causing the majority of the problems? Tomorrow at work count the number of cyclists you see on the road and count the number of commercial vehicles you see. Apply the 2% to each total and see if cyclists are really the majority of those causing issues on the roads.

[twobits]

OK. I tried to extend a hand in peace, and you instead chose to deflect. This is not about counting how many big rigs on the road vs. cyclists. It is not about 2% of the population that are brain dead no matter what their mode of transportation is. This is about cyclists on roadways that have no designated bike lane. The law says cyclists can use the lane of traffic....and I will even disregard the part that says they should remain as far right as possible on the asphalt. They are also not expected to ride on gravel shoulder.
So, when there is not a paved shoulder, should the interpretation of the MVA not be that the cyclist pulls over and allows traffic that is piled up behind them pass at the closest available spot to do so? Just as required by big rigs or the faint of heart Honda Accord drivers that do not or can not maintain the speed of the flow of traffic?
You talk about share the road and courtesy yet all I hear from you is a god given right to travel on a hwy so we should all just suck it up and accept your comfort pants presence as the weakest link in our hwy transportation network that we all have to defer to? And I would also add.....not commuting for work, performing work as say a courier, or riding for groceries and sustenance. These people are excluded. None of these people, the few that there are, are on the hwy in neon colored club jersey's in comfort pants perusing sport. They are not on road bikes either. They will be on a more practicable mountain bike that they bought used for 300 bucks that they can hang a cpl of grocery bags on the handle bars. Definitely won't be the 5k to 10k carbon fibre framed road bike I see holding up traffic every gdamn day.

[lowrenzo]

So, instead of all this disagreeing, why don't we agree that there is a safety and congestion issue regarding cyclists on our highways. How do we solve this problem? More bike lanes would certainly help. We could start with Eastside Road. Who do we lobby?

[twobits]

So, instead of all this disagreeing, why don't we agree that there is a safety and congestion issue regarding cyclists on our highways. How do we solve this problem? More bike lanes would certainly help. We could start with Eastside Road. Who do we lobby?

You could start with the Mayor wearing the comfort azz pants. It would seem his business plan is invite them all, get a 100k in funding to put up signs for cycling routes, and then go for funding of proper shoulders when a dozen cyclists have been killed and traffic is gridlocked.
It's the reverse of "build it and they come". This is more, "invite them and when they come, build it because it has obviously become a problem".

[XT225]

You could start with the Mayor wearing the comfort azz pants. It would seem his business plan is invite them all, get a 100k in funding to put up signs for cycling routes, and then go for funding of proper shoulders when a dozen cyclists have been killed and traffic is gridlocked.
It's the reverse of "build it and they come". This is more, "invite them and when they come, build it because it has obviously become a problem".

I would start one notch higher up than our mayor. Its Dan Ashton who is responsible for giving that 100 grand for signage BEFORE making proper paved shoulders. As always, Ashton loves to be in a photo op giving things away but that in my opinion is wasted money. Its putting the cart before the horse.

[lowrenzo]

Maybe we should all pass along a link to this thread to the mayor and the MLA and the Minister of Highways.

[southy]

Maybe we should all pass along a link to this thread to the mayor and the MLA and the Minister of Highways.

Ahhh lowrenzo ... Not sure that would be a good idea. As XT recently posted Dan Ashton knows about cycling in our area better than most .. well almost ... that's where Mayor Jak comes in. I would assume you already know this both Ashton and Jak have many many friends who are cyclists. Need I say more. By chance are you one ?

[Giants Head]

I think that Twobits should buy a GoPro and put it on the dash of one of his trucks. You know what they say. A picture is worth a thousand words. I'm sure that he could get some excellent video.

[twobits]

I think that Twobits should buy a GoPro and put it on the dash of one of his trucks. You know what they say. A picture is worth a thousand words. I'm sure that he could get some excellent video.

Not a bad idea at all. A "best of cyclist fails in the south ok similk". I had to google GoPro to understand what you were referring to though.....bit of an old fart. I will try to educate myself on this tech and see if it is practical for me to employ. It's the upload download part that will be the fail part for me.
Would make for an interesting thread though......"Vehicle/cyclist interaction fails". If some of you already have these camera's......?

[XT225]

Twobits, just a heads up. You might want to stay in Church a little longer this coming Sunday, or just stay home. The Grandfondo bike race is happening here and traffic will be disrupted a bit.

[Bsuds]

.bit of an old fart. I will try to educate myself on this tech and see if it is practical for me to employ. It's the upload download part that will be the fail part for me.

Well if yer that old maybe just stay home and solve 2 problems...lol

[ToddT]

I leave town for the Gran Fondo. I hate that stupid thing.